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Topic: What is considered poverty in Brandon ?
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Rue

7/11/2018 1:06:55 PM
Member since:
May 2009
Total posts:1301
What is considered poverty in Brandon ?

Brandon Sun article got me to thinking .

myhandleistrain

7/11/2018 1:14:37 PM
Member since:
Mar 2016
Total posts:205
Stats

These may not be totally accurate, but I think a single person income of about $22,000 and a family of three about $35,000.

GhOsTID

7/11/2018 10:18:10 PM
Member since:
Jul 2012
Total posts:156
.

  
myhandleistrain said "These may not be totally accurate, but I think a single person income of about $22,000 and a family of three about $35,000. "

I am not doing very well it seems.

Abbysmum

7/11/2018 11:51:44 PM
Member since:
Mar 2009
Total posts:3128
poverty

I didn't read the article but like I'm sure you've sumrized it's a variable and fluid definition that not everyone agrees on. A general working definition seems to be that you are considered poor if you make less than 50% of the median income for your area, which basically is the bottom quarter of the population.  
 
For reference, the median income per family in Brandon is $84,386 with the average economic family size of 2.9 people per Stats Canada.  
 
But that doesn't tell the whole story, I suppose. You can be making above the 50% of median, but if you can't afford housing because it's so darn expensive, are you poor?

JosephC

7/12/2018 7:27:24 AM
Member since:
May 2018
Total posts:8
Median Income

is absolutely not a good measure of what is considered poverty. Median total income is the point where half earn more, and half earn less (not the bottom quarter).  
 
For families with 2 or more people, it is roughly $84,000 in Brandon (before tax).  
 
$84,000 is certainly not the income at which someone is poor or not poor. If you're poor at $80,000, you've made some bad decisions.

Sashaa

7/12/2018 11:43:49 AM
Member since:
Dec 2014
Total posts:116
I WISH that I made 84,000.....!

I am on provincial medical disability and considered poverty level. You will fall off your chairs when I tell you that I live on a total of about $10,000 a year from my medical benefits and whatever my family allowance is at roughly an extra $420/month. I support myself, my little boy and his dad on this SMALL income......so others on the same disability make roughly the same. I would consider THIS the poverty line, as some days we don't eat to make sure our son has a full healthy meal and we might eat the leftovers if there is any after our son eats his fill. If we made $84,000 we would be SO happy! LOL!

Abbysmum

7/12/2018 6:40:07 PM
Member since:
Mar 2009
Total posts:3128
re read

  
JosephC said "is absolutely not a good measure of what is considered poverty. Median total income is the point where half earn more, and half earn less (not the bottom quarter).  
 
For families with 2 or more people, it is roughly $84,000 in Brandon (before tax).  
 
$84,000 is certainly not the income at which someone is poor or not poor. If you're poor at $80,000, you've made some bad decisions. "

Poverty, by some definition is 50% of the median income.  
 
So, if the median income for 2.9 people (the theoretical family size used for this area) is $84K, 50% of that is $42k for basically 3 people. So yes, that's the bottom quarter.  
 
I'm not saying it's a great measure, but it's one that is used.

Walleyeking44

7/12/2018 6:54:07 PM
Member since:
Jun 2018
Total posts:27
.....

Who cares.. it is what it is. Everyone chooses there own paths

Brenda..

7/12/2018 6:57:15 PM
Member since:
Jul 2005
Total posts:9337
no

  
Walleyeking44 said "Who cares.. it is what it is. Everyone chooses there own paths "

not true at all.  
 
 
Good job, great wage, great benefits, 23 years with the same company.  
 
Bang - an illness - I did not chose that path or to be struck with an illness.  
 
from living on a great wage and working to living on CPP disability.  
 
Edited by Brenda.., 2018-07-12 19:03:03

Rue

7/12/2018 7:16:37 PM
Member since:
May 2009
Total posts:1301
poverty

  
Walleyeking44 said "Who cares.. it is what it is. Everyone chooses there own paths "

wrong  
 
do we choose to have health issues or disabilities ?

JosephC

7/12/2018 7:31:16 PM
Member since:
May 2018
Total posts:8
Apologies

  
Abbysmum said "
  
JosephC said "is absolutely not a good measure of what is considered poverty. Median total income is the point where half earn more, and half earn less (not the bottom quarter).  
 
For families with 2 or more people, it is roughly $84,000 in Brandon (before tax).  
 
$84,000 is certainly not the income at which someone is poor or not poor. If you're poor at $80,000, you've made some bad decisions. "

Poverty, by some definition is 50% of the median income.  
 
So, if the median income for 2.9 people (the theoretical family size used for this area) is $84K, 50% of that is $42k for basically 3 people. So yes, that's the bottom quarter.  
 
I'm not saying it's a great measure, but it's one that is used. "

I misread what you were saying. It was too early!  
 
50% of the median does make sense. Not a great measure, but I get the concept upon paying more attention to what you wrote

underXtheXradar

7/12/2018 7:31:16 PM
Member since:
May 2016
Total posts:99
Really?

  
Walleyeking44 said "Who cares.. it is what it is. Everyone chooses there own paths "

Give your head a shake. This has got to be one of the most ignorant comments I''ve read on here in a long time.  
 
This type of comment assumes that everyone has the same opportunities, experiences, abilities and help.  
 
I grew up as child of the system. In and out of foster care my whole life. Every adult around me was either a bad influence (drugs, alcohol, crime). or someone who judged me because of my family (teachers, guidance counsellors,...the very people who should have been in a position to help me.)  
 
I honestly graduated high school thinking that things like college were out of the realm of possibility for me. Because people in my life had treated me like trash, I believed it. I had a teacher once tell me that I was "destined to end up a welfare bum like your dad. Or maybe at best you''ll wind up flipping burgers or washing dishes."  
 
It took moving away from the toxic environment I was brought up in, and the intervention from some REALLY kind people who saw potential in me, and THEN me overcoming my pride enough to accept their help. And it took a LOT of years of hard work. But I now have overcome addiction, gotten an education, gotten married, own my own home, have a great job. Life is great. People look at me and have no idea where I came from.  
 
So you might be thinking "This proves my point, you dug yourself out of a bad situation. People choose their own paths." but you would be very very wrong. I was extremely lucky. Extremely lucky to have met good adults and role models who were willing to work hard to help me break down the barriers and walls that my upbringing had built. It took a long time for those people to un-do the damage that had been done to me physically and mentally.  
 
If I didn''t have help from those kind people, I would have ended up like so many other people I know who came from similar situations. Because when you are raised your whole life having people tell you that you won''t amount to anything, you believe it. You don''t mean to. It just feels like a sinking weight that slowly pulls you down until you are completely convinced that you have no worth. And when you think you have no worth and nothing to offer, then everything seems pointless.  
 
I was extremely lucky. But I put no judgement whatsoever into the people I knew who weren''t so lucky. Many of whom ended up in prison, others ended up dead. But ALL of the ones who survived that I can think of all live in poverty. I can't think of a single other kid in my situation I knew that didn't/isn't struggling with poverty.  
 
Give your head a shake. Open your eyes to understand the world and people''s realities are much larger than your narrow viewpoint.  
 
Edited by underXtheXradar, 2018-07-12 19:34:13

Walleyeking44

7/12/2018 7:34:28 PM
Member since:
Jun 2018
Total posts:27
... i shook it

Still have the same opinion

GTLRvs

7/12/2018 7:38:09 PM
Member since:
Mar 2008
Total posts:9
father?

is there a reason why cant your childs Dad cant work and make money to support you since your on disability?

Brenda..

7/12/2018 7:43:22 PM
Member since:
Jul 2005
Total posts:9337
live

  
Walleyeking44 said "Still have the same opinion "

in fantasy or have a fantastic job, the big house, all the toys and owe the bank a lot of money - or you are just lucky to get some breaks and get where you are.  
 
It is definitely not from respect, ethical thinking, problem solving that go you were you are.  
 
Carry on - enjoy your misguided opinion.

FreeCycler

7/12/2018 8:06:23 PM
Member since:
Aug 2011
Total posts:137
what's considered poverty in Brandon?

how about generic noodles and mac 'n cheez?  
Been there. Done that for years.  
Sometimes healthy food is too pricey.

underXtheXradar

7/12/2018 8:21:35 PM
Member since:
May 2016
Total posts:99
what a shock

I get that you wouldn''t want to have to consider opening your mind and questioning your world view. It might cause you to have to ask tough questions and maybe see things from another person''s perspective. That would really be tough.  
 
In high school I had a friend.. Let''s call him...John. John grew up in a super wealthy home where his father owned a business which had a monopoly on industrial welding in the area I grew up. John''s hardest choices in high school were whether he was going to take the Corvette, the Hummer or the Power Wagon to school. When he eventually went to college he spent 7 years partying his way though a 4 year course, and then promptly started working in the family business and is about to take over where he EASILY takes home 6 figures.  
 
If you asked John, he''d tell you he was a self-made man. And he''d believe it. He is entirely unable or unwilling to question his world view, because if he had to admit that he had a million advantages and actually earned very little of the privilege he enjoys, it would make his question his worth. And John can''t have that. He needs to stay king of the castle.  
 
The thing about some people who grow up with privilege is that they believe in a terrible lie. They believe that everyone starts off equal, and that if you''re not wealthy, its because you didn''t earn it, and it''s only because of your own poor choices. They''re unwilling to open their minds to the idea that people are affected negatively or positively by factors far outside their own control.  
 
Your viewpoint sounds a lot like John to me.  
 
 
**To be clear, if this post seems like I think there is something wrong with wealth, I want to make it emphatically clear that I don't. I think that success and wealth are inherently good things. So long as the person with the wealth doesn't see it as an excuse to look down on others.  
 
Edited by underXtheXradar, 2018-07-12 20:29:38

GoWheatiesGo

7/12/2018 9:20:09 PM
Member since:
Sep 2016
Total posts:58
...

  
Walleyeking44 said "Still have the same opinion "

I really hope you don’t have someone looking up to you as a role model

Abbysmum

7/12/2018 9:33:11 PM
Member since:
Mar 2009
Total posts:3128
choices

I'm not arguing poor is poor - I mean, if you have to choose between paying rent or buying food because you literally can't do both, you're poor. Those really at the bottom of the income ladder (say, the bottom 5 or 10%) are poor by anyone's definition.  
 
But let's use the definition I posted above (50% of the median income) as an example. $42K a year for 3 people seems outright luxious to some people posting in this thread. I worked with the tax system for awhile, and I saw how little so many people have to live on. I've had friends that have been poor. It was heart-breaking to watch them have to make really tough choices sometimes (and while I would help out when I could, I wasn't always able to).  
 
If I adjusted that amount [42k] for my larger-than-average family size, we would be flirting with the definition of poor. But we are most definately not poor. But we make careful choices with our money, because we have to or else we WOULD have to make those tough choices.  
 
So again, what is poor?  
 
Food for thought - I recently read that if you make US$30K a year or more (it was an American stat), you earn more than 95% of the world's population. Most of them have a much lower cost of living (and often a lower living standard to go along with that), but that also goes to show that when we're talking about poverty, income levels alone don't tell the whole story.

Never_give_up

7/13/2018 8:42:10 AM
Member since:
Apr 2010
Total posts:349
first

  
underXtheXradar said "
  
Walleyeking44 said "Who cares.. it is what it is. Everyone chooses there own paths "

Give your head a shake. This has got to be one of the most ignorant comments I''ve read on here in a long time.  
 
This type of comment assumes that everyone has the same opportunities, experiences, abilities and help.  
 
I grew up as child of the system. In and out of foster care my whole life. Every adult around me was either a bad influence (drugs, alcohol, crime). or someone who judged me because of my family (teachers, guidance counsellors,...the very people who should have been in a position to help me.)  
 
I honestly graduated high school thinking that things like college were out of the realm of possibility for me. Because people in my life had treated me like trash, I believed it. I had a teacher once tell me that I was "destined to end up a welfare bum like your dad. Or maybe at best you''ll wind up flipping burgers or washing dishes."  
 
It took moving away from the toxic environment I was brought up in, and the intervention from some REALLY kind people who saw potential in me, and THEN me overcoming my pride enough to accept their help. And it took a LOT of years of hard work. But I now have overcome addiction, gotten an education, gotten married, own my own home, have a great job. Life is great. People look at me and have no idea where I came from.  
 
So you might be thinking "This proves my point, you dug yourself out of a bad situation. People choose their own paths." but you would be very very wrong. I was extremely lucky. Extremely lucky to have met good adults and role models who were willing to work hard to help me break down the barriers and walls that my upbringing had built. It took a long time for those people to un-do the damage that had been done to me physically and mentally.  
 
If I didn''t have help from those kind people, I would have ended up like so many other people I know who came from similar situations. Because when you are raised your whole life having people tell you that you won''t amount to anything, you believe it. You don''t mean to. It just feels like a sinking weight that slowly pulls you down until you are completely convinced that you have no worth. And when you think you have no worth and nothing to offer, then everything seems pointless.  
 
I was extremely lucky. But I put no judgement whatsoever into the people I knew who weren''t so lucky. Many of whom ended up in prison, others ended up dead. But ALL of the ones who survived that I can think of all live in poverty. I can't think of a single other kid in my situation I knew that didn't/isn't struggling with poverty.  
 
Give your head a shake. Open your eyes to understand the world and people''s realities are much larger than your narrow viewpoint.  
 
Edited by underXtheXradar, 2018-07-12 19:34:13"

Congratulation underXtheXrader on overcoming a childhood that easily set you up for a lifetime of failure.  
Second, you weren't lucky. You worked your butt off to get to where you are today, own that, don't give luck the credit. You did the hard work all on your own.

Brian

7/13/2018 10:46:36 AM
Member since:
Feb 2007
Total posts:474
I agree with Brenda

  
Brenda.. said "
  
Walleyeking44 said "Who cares.. it is what it is. Everyone chooses there own paths "

not true at all.  
 
 
Good job, great wage, great benefits, 23 years with the same company.  
 
Bang - an illness - I did not chose that path or to be struck with an illness.  
 
from living on a great wage and working to living on CPP disability.  
 
Edited by Brenda.., 2018-07-12 19:03:03"

I to did not choose this path after surgery in Winnipeg and contracting meningitis and stroke from dr screw ups I had to give up my land and cattle now my family have tough go I didn't choose this I would rather live in country any day thank you Manitoba medical system

JessieJay

7/13/2018 1:38:31 PM
Member since:
Mar 2016
Total posts:413
Privilege

If you think growing up privileged does not give you advantages in life, maybe watch this video. Really watch it right to the end. Everyone does not have an equal start in life.  
https://youtu.be/4K5fbQ1-zps

Brenda..

7/13/2018 3:14:18 PM
Member since:
Jul 2005
Total posts:9337
excellent

  
JessieJay said "If you think growing up privileged does not give you advantages in life, maybe watch this video. Really watch it right to the end. Everyone does not have an equal start in life.  
https://youtu.be/4K5fbQ1-zps "

great watch.

Shebear

7/13/2018 3:51:00 PM
Member since:
Aug 2013
Total posts:371
healthy food

  
FreeCycler said "how about generic noodles and mac 'n cheez?  
Been there. Done that for years.  
Sometimes healthy food is too pricey. "

Hi Yup healthy food can be pricey and the prices of meat are nuts unless you are really lucky to find a sale. I am on disbility like the other person who posted on here and it is tough but I'm thankful for it as it's better than homeless. I find if you buy frozen veggies instead of fresh that helps, and eating less meat and cutting down on portion sizes. Add a small basic fresh salad with your meal to make it stretch if possible. Then have a day you go out and have a treat. Buy stuff from Dollar Tree and Dollarama for basic stuff (even get taco kits there). Fresh or organic is pricey but can be done if get it on sale or frozen, again portion size which isnt easy to get used to but it really helps...that way no in a family should go hungry . Generic is good and you can add tuna or hot dogs or whatever to mac n cheese, or have small bit of meat on the side of mac n cheese, and a small salad or small veggies. I still think there is no reason with the amount of food our country is blessed with that there should be any hungry people in our country.

Rue

7/13/2018 9:32:25 PM
Member since:
May 2009
Total posts:1301
you are

  
Walleyeking44 said "Still have the same opinion "

a very bitter man something or someone sure turned you sour .

 
 
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