Discussions

Am I crazy or were Donald Trumps tariff threats focused around us simply enforcing our borders and slowing the tide of drugs and migrant crossings ?  
 
Or was there more to it than that ?  
 
I keep thinking we could have killed two birds with one stone by increasing our NATO spending to the agreed upon 2% and utilizing those forces as drone operators and quick reaction teams stationed at posts along the border.  
 
Essentially the same way the US does it on their southern border  
 
Who in their right mind decided that leasing 2 helicopters and stretching the already understaffed RCMP forces to encompass this was a good idea ?

Anyone that’s read the comments this morning and still thinks this is about fentanyl isn’t paying attention. Our pharmaceutical “drug” prices get as much of a mention as drug drugs:  
https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/article/as-sunday-began-trump-blasts-canada-as-not-a-viable-country-follow-live-updates-here/  
 
The man is truly insane and if judging on actions seems to be applying that inanity to try to crush this country’s economy. There’s been no true justification given for this kind of action and the closest to an out that’s been given is the “51st state” bunk.  
 
There isn’t a lot to gain from fighting amongst ourselves. Whether we’ve agreed or disagreed in the past, we need all hands on deck on the same side of this fight recognizing that the most useful thing we can do right now is to buy and support Canadian and listen to what our leaders ask of us (whether or not we’ve agreed with those leaders in the past and whether or not we’d support their future politics). 

Be strong. Be Canadian. Please show empathy and support for your fellow Canadians even if they don't completely seem like themselves this week. There are going to be people going through a lot as long as this is going on and we're a billion times better together in this fight. 

knows Canada has a weak leader and he is just giving Trudeau a good smack in the face before he finally departs. Liberals got no answers on how to deal with Trump. USA will look after USA and so they should. We need a government that will look after the interests of all Canadians. Crime is running rampant in this country and the drugs flow in with ease.

There are zero facts to backup the claim that drugs flow with ease to the point of what we're seeing this weekend or that Canada hasn't made serious changes to make it even harder. 43 lbs seized at the Canada border last year vs more than 21,000 at the Mexican border:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/andyjsemotiuk/2025/01/31/tariff-on-canada-not-justified-by-us-immigration-and-drug-claims/ 

This is looking more and more by the day to clearly not be about drugs, the topic sure looks like it's being used as a sort of front for what is essentially an attack on our country whatever the unjustifiable reason might be.

This isn't about trying to pave the way for our candidate of choice to get their 4 years with the country how ever many weeks or months down the line. This is about now. What are you doing to try to support this country saving its economy today and this week. Making partisan political posts and trying to spread disinformation online doesn’t count. I hope the best for you and your family and that you aren't among the many whose jobs and retirements are at stake this week. 

I think this has to go more in the direction of cooperation with Mexico, encouraging to hear that our leaders had what sounded like a long talk yesterday. With CP’s merger a few years ago their tracks run all the way from Mexico through to Canada, and CN's tracks to the Gulf of Mexico. Both look like they might have capacity to spare now.  
 
Because the unhinged individual to the South is selling this as a fake national security emergency that could get messy for our rails caught in the middle. I know that after screening for Buy Canadian I won’t be discriminating against product of Mexico.

Not to for a second minimize how awful it is in Ukraine, but we're basically seeing an economic version of the Putin playbook. Fabricate a reason, repeat it until you make it so with enough of your supporters as justification for aggression.

Latest genius move is complaining about how we don’t let their banks in.  
 
Say hypothetically after this all plays out, after however it’s resolved it’s open season for their banks to come here and compete with ours. Does he really think that they stand a chance of getting enough business after his country just did what he had it do to 40M of us?  
 
Different industry with its own challenges, but I think back to Target and how they felt they could buy into this market and ppl would flock to a brand they’ve been waiting for. It wasn’t as easy as they thought, and I suspect at least one of the reasons is some Americans misunderstand how a lot of Canadians define themselves and it isn’t always a yearning to be living the American life.  
 
Even if this all ends tomorrow with standing down (which doesn’t look like the case), the damage done to USA reputation with a lot of Canadians this weekend could already take a generation if not more to get past. That I think would flow through to any business that gains an advantage because of this aggression that has no justification. 

No tariffs for at least 30 days.  
If you want a sign for how Canada did over the past couple days, Fox news leads its story of trying to make the case that their guy got them a win by describing that Canada will do things it already said it will do toward the end of last year. Looks like a couple other things added in.  
 
CTV has been doing a good running factual take at:  
https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/article/tariffs-on-canada-delayed-for-30-days-after-talk-between-trudeau-and-trump-live-updates-here/ 

End of the day there seems to be about as wide of agreement as you can get that Canada needs to diversify its trade relationships from here

Long ways to go from 43 to 21,000.
I'd say the case in the link was interprovincial until proven otherwise, its great to see they got them.

Try all you want to rationalize the irrational demands of an irrational old dude that represents a country other than the one you (I assume) and I live and pay taxes in, but its hard to imagine a factual case to compare fentanyl coming through Mexico and through Canada that would justify anywhere near the size of the hammer that was being threatened on a peaceful neighbour that was trying to have dialogue. As recently as a day ago he couldn't even tell us what he needed us to do and meandered into a rant about banks (a rant that itself was based on misinfo). I thought the lady in this clip put it all pretty well:

https://www.cnn.com/2025/02/03/politics/video/trump-canada-tariffs-pause-catherine-rampell-scott-jennings-digvid-tsr 

At any rate, we're upping our game in the way we said we would in December with a little more on top for good measure. Hopefully next time for the sake of ~500M people across all three countries they'll at least be specific in what it is they want and have the lines of communication a little more open before going right to threatening everyone's livelihood.

My guess is kick the can down the road enough that he+Musk can try to influence our election in the direction of a candidate they see as more of a like mind, then try for a new USMCA with that new & inexperienced gov if they get their way. But who knows, I think just gotta live, go into hyperdrive on building out more trade relationships, know our strengths and work from them. After the "not a nation" and "51st state" stuff it wouldn't hurt to explore with like-minded democratic nations who might be in our corner as much as most look like they have their own battles to worry about too!

Trump ran his campaign promising tariffs. That is over a year of notice. Our government did nothing. There was a meeting where the whole 51st state and governor crap started, where tariffs were discussed again. Justin came back and resigned shortly after that, shutting down government so this issue can not be properly dealt with.  
It is amazing how everyone is so angry about tariffs, that is a tax on Americans, not us. Yes it may trickle back to us, but on items they need, they will still need, so it will only cost them more. The demand is still there. will California decide not to rebuild because there is a tariff on lumber? Will the auto industry shut down because of mineral tariffs? Will the farmers shut down because of fertilizer tariffs? They will adapt and carry on like always. Americans will absorb the costs. There is no possible way they could build the infrastructure to make up the difference in the term Trump has. Not to mention the resources they do not have at all, or enough of, (Potash, metals, oil, electricity)  
If we want something to get angry about, how about the impending 20% carbon tax increase in April? Everyone is so worked up about Trump taxing his people that we ignore our government bending us over. Just think of how removing the carbon tax will help all of those companies being impacted by tariffs? it would likely offset the slight decrease in sales.  
Also don't give me the crap that we need a carbon tax to save the environment! nobody is writing a cheque to mother nature to heal herself. It does nothing to stop the big polluters like China, India, South America and many more.  
Instead of blaming Trump for doing exactly what he promised for over a year, lets hold our government accountable.  
 
Edited by Indadumps, 2025-02-04 08:41:28

let the facts get in the way of a good story. Incredible. Would be a nice change to have your spin left out of these conversations.

One of the sadder parts of all of this is its really shined a light on how there's a faction within us that are so taken advantage of by partisanship that they're willing to ride some quite creative rationalizations and wilful blindness to taking another country's position over their own. Like the anti-vax crowd during Covid, they do make quite a bit of noise online and attract a lot of attention even if they don't represent the average person.  
 
I don't know I've seen one economist making the case that with 25% increased costs, the merry go round will keep turning without serious impact on both sides of the border. What are your credentials to be taken seriously in providing such a unique creative counterpoint?  
 
'Minerals' weren't the reason the auto industry would have to shut down. See stories about full supply chain, how parts and eventually finished product move between the three countries and the end purchase cost that the consumer in all countries would've been having to find the money for to keep the industry viable.  
 
It's pretty wild how some partisans are so lit up on the Carbon Tax topic that they still try to work it into every online exchange. This is a discussion about tariffs and what was (is?) an existential threat to our sovereignty by a neighbour. I think even the aspiring politicians that got people fired up on the Carbon Tax narrative in the first place have pulled back on it. The tax (and the cheques that came with it) are almost for sure on the way out and look like there'll be replaced by something that still places a cost on pollution that's sending the planet downstream, but in a way that's easier for the end consumer to relate to.  
 
I hope you'll take some time to do a little more reading on tariffs and their impacts. The more informed we all are, the better these discussions go. Here's an extensive info page put out by the Bank of Canada that's a great chance to get up to speed with our country's perspective and how tariffs would flow through both economies, send inflation up and hit GDP growth hard:  
https://www.bankofcanada.ca/publications/mpr/mpr-2025-01-29/in-focus-1/

That’s awful, I’m sorry to hear that.  
Hopefully the pause changes that, a little concerned that this is gonna put a chill on a lot of things. I think there’s still going to be quite a bit of label checking up here with how much trust has been burnt (I will be anyway). Could make the case Americans might not be as dug in with everything else they have going on right now?

Just to add re the 43 lbs…  
Globe story today shares that a little more than 1/3 of that (14.8 lbs) came from a single bust in Spokane, WA that didn't even get to the border from the USA side. Vehicle came from the South via Phoenix and “was included in the total because of its proximity to the border and the involvement of northern border patrol staff in the investigation.”  Canada not even mentioned in the affidavit from the border agent:
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-white-house-fentanyl-seizure-canadian-border-data/ 

so now we're talking ~28 lbs vs 20,000+