Discussions

Having just read the Metis Federation letter regarding their viewpoint on the disruption (news item) and very much agreeing with the content, I am at a loss to understand why the protestors have not been removed under the railway regulations.  
This from the CP website:-  
"Trains and railway property are private property.  
 
Walking on railway property is trespassing and illegal. This property i:ncludes the right-of-way, which extends 50 feet from either side of the track.  
 
In Canada, federal offences under the Railway Safety Act range as high as $10,000. Fines vary by province."  
 
What am I missing here ?  
In light of the images showing burning tires on the tracks as train wagons pass, this surely has to be an offence and possibly endangering lives.  
I fully agree that people have a right to protest but it has to be within the law of the land.

I'll have to look for the statement from the Metis.  
 
Good thing the trains weren't hauling flammable goods, the protesters would have been blown away. What are they thinking?

https://discoverwestman.com/local/mb-metis-federation-responds-to-blockades

To bad the tax payers are paying the bill again and these groups are getting away with it this is far beyond protesting. I see no future in corporations trying to start projects with backlash all the time. Where is all this money that is always demanded coming from we are going broke fast. There is to many groups to deal with and no one knows who represents who anymore. Well all I can say it will be a long time till you see me in a casino thats my protest.

It's kind of ironic that the railway has its very own police force and even they are not removing or dismantling these blockades, it must be so frustrating being a LEO and having your hands tied by government , all the while the government feeds us bs that it doesn't tell the police what to do.

so much for providing this link! I read it and agree 100%

Not just FN protesting. There are eco activists involved as many already know.  
 
And we find out the other day that our own tax dollars were in part used to fund these people.  
 
The libs got caught and lied about it but in the end were forced to apologize. Quite telling.  
 
China builds another coal plant every other week and we’re standing here bickering and disrupting the country over a natural gas pipeline that would begin to curtail their emissions if built.  
 
These protesters can’t see the forest through the trees.  
 
Edited by KDK, 2020-02-27 05:28:45

Do people really believe that natural gas from Canada will curtail coal use in China? I think that you underestimate China’s intention to generate power and maintain their manufacturing output with whatever means possible and at whatever cost to the environment. I doubt that anything we do or supply into China will even make a dent in their overall emissions. China will use the cheapest most abundant fuels available to them.  
 
Edited by Farmergeorge, 2020-02-27 07:48:33

The irony is in this too...protests (including eco-activists) because of potential harm to the environment...and then burning tires? It is sending a very mixed message.

I think there is another part of this that deserves discussion.  
 
the elected leaders of the first nation involved in the B.C. blockade, already signed an agreement to allow the construction of the pipeline on their territory.  
 
now the hereditary chiefs are blockading the area.  
 
do we now have to deal with 2 separate native leaderships?  
 
if the elected leaders will not take a stand for an agreement they signed, then why are we dealing with them?  
 
this can set a very dangerous precedent.  
 
can any agreement we sign with their elected leadership, be broken by a group of hereditary chiefs?  
 
if we allow them to get away with this now, it will happen in the future anytime someone has a grievance with development.  
 
I think it is time for the first nations to decide what government they want.  
 
elected leaders or a monarchy.  
 
but we should not be expected to deal with both.

in Manitoba as a personal protest. (not that I gamble personally) The southern chiefs organization as well as the metis federation of manitoba have both stated that the barricades must come down . Here in manitoba we see a more respectful way of protest (which is a person's right) avoiding the hurtful outcomes to innocent individuals such as we see happening out east. Good on folks in Manitoba.

Do you read anything other than the western producer, farmergeorge?  
 
China is attempting to triple its lng imports by 2035.  
 
Edited by KDK, 2020-02-27 10:26:30

The worlds largest open cast coal mine is developed in Australia to feed Chinese demand. BBC news

The people in China need to burn coal to supply there basic electrical needs. Is it fair for us to tell them they don’t deserve to have electricity while we sit here in bask in all the powers electricity has to offer. .... I think that’s kinda rude.  
 
So we as Canadians should do our part. Supply them with a cleaner gas to burn so they can have simple life’s necessity. I’ve already showed you how much cleaner natural gas is then coal in another post.  
 
The only reason they burn coal is cause it’s readily available. Let’s make our commodity’s readily available so we as Canadians can help lower the global green house gas emissions.

Liberal government (Bill Blair - Public Safety Minister) claimed today that these protests do not fit the criminal code definition of terrorism.  
 
I beg to differ from this passage from the Government of Canada's own website....  
 
 
"In Canada, section 83.01 of the Criminal Code[1] defines terrorism as an act committed "in whole or in part for a political, religious or ideological purpose, o:bjective or cause" with the intention of intimidating the public "…with regard to its security, including its economic security, or compelling a person, a government or a domestic or an international organization to do or to refrain from doing any act." Activities recognized as criminal within this context i:nclude death and bodily harm with the use of violence: endangering a person’s life: risks posed to the health and safety of the public: significant property damage: and interference or disruption of essential services, facilities or systems. "  
 
Many of these protesters are peaceful and I respect their right to do so, but there are far too many that fit the definition of terrorists and it is time for the RCMP to be allowed to do their jobs and clean it up to protect the public.

This is all about money. It’s all about extracting Canada’s resources to make the highest dollar and make the wealthy even richer. I don’t think it will do a thing to reduce the impact of climate change.

Look at the numbers man. Natural gas is extremely cleaner then coal. Imagine burning coal in your house. The dust. The soot. Do we ever have to clean our chimneys now from natural gas furnaces.?  
 
Saying they don’t need power plants is extremely naive. What fuel they burn all debentures what’s readily available to them. Let’s make Canada’s resources available.

What fuel they burn all depends what is readily available to them.

They’re also expanding their lng pipeline network and ports. What’s your point?  
 
They import coal too so let’s not bother selling them gas?  
 
If what we’re told about climate change is true and time is a big factor then it’s only logical to start with the biggest issue first.  
 
China.  
 
It’s clear they want the gas.  
 
The easiest route would be to convert the coal to gas. This would realize the biggest reduction in c02 emissions until further advancements can be made.  
 
 
 
The fact is, no matter where the gas goes in China it’s a good thing that however many megawatts it produces is not being produced by coal. That’s the point, because it sure as hell isn’t going to be replaced by solar and wind anytime soon.

On CBC news you can check and read that the SCO are planning four blockades at four different highways on March 20, They picked that date, which is a Friday, purposely because it is the start of a weekend. The blockades are to last for two hours.  
 
The Metis do not endorse the blockades.

Not really impressed with blockades which affect people who really aren’t part of the problem. The problem as I see it has to do with governance issues among the First Nations people.  
In reference to the high road I see a lot of hate in different stories on this once you get to the comments sections. I am encouraged that there are no reciprocated blockages at Reserves. Maybe not everyone, but for myself stopping those people of the Reserves from getting out and getting to jobs that they have, or trying to keep people from living their lives in a way that they are accustomed to would make us no better that those who are illegally protesting.  
Never do two wrongs make a right.  
 
Edited by don brown, 2020-02-27 22:35:42

My point is that China will burn gas in addition to their hunger for coal . They are not going to let up on their use of fossil fuels one little bit and their government have no interest in trying to reduce carbon emissions. Canada’s interest in supplying natural gas to China is purely financial. It’s about money and greed.

If that was the only thing it was about. Why not have some one in Canada making the money. The spinoff effects of that company making money will benifit Canada. Good high paying jobs will come, with those jobs will come a great tax base for Canada. The spinoff effect would be great.  
 
We haven’t even touched on the fact gas is so much cleaner then coal.  
 
Yes your right china gunna burn whatever it can because it NEEDS to to supply its country with energy. Canada can step up and be a leading supplier to them with greener energy. In return making the world a better place. It’s like that baseball movie. If you build it they will come.  
 
The customers are there. We just gotta build the pipe and supply them.

In Canada here we can be the greenest we want to be. Introduce a 100 dollar a ton each carbon tax. Have a zero carbon footprint. We can be the greenest people on the entire planet. If our neighbors across the ocean are still  
Gonna be coal burning green house gas emitting polluters. It really isn’t doing the whole world any better.  
 
That’s why building the pipe is so crucial on a global  
Level cause it will reduce the amount of coal China will need to burn significantly. Metric tones of coal won’t be burnt after they get the pipeline built.

If we want to make a difference then we each need to reduce our energy and fuel usage, reduce flying, reduce our food wastage and consume smaller portions, prepare food from naturally produced raw product (produced as locally as possible) and reduce consumption of ultra processed factory produced foods, where possible grow food in our own gardens, recycle more and compost where possible, buy less new ‘stuff’ that we don’t need reducing the need for manufacturing and energy. A little less consumption by everyone will make a big environmental difference in the long run.  
 
Edited by Farmergeorge, 2020-02-28 09:02:31

I agree in all those things 1000%. I try and do them myself. But what difference does it make if China just keeps burning coal because, well they have no other options.  
 
We can be better then just reducing what we waste. We can be leading the forefront suppling a whole other nation with cleaning greener energy. If it’s global warming on a global scale we have to look at places we can make changes on a global level.  
 
When the next ice age comes it’s not going to skip Canada cause we made the least waste or had the greenest energy.

If I start a business and it does well...I hire a few people because I want to grow my business and I really enjoy what I’m doing. I run my business responsibly, respectfully and with integrity. The business or product markets itself once people are aware of it and things are going awesome, I can hire a few more people and the business is thriving. You and your business maybe are not doing quite as well....so....does that make me greedy?  
With getting more business I can employ a few more people...perhaps even employ and help educate some of our immigrants... and we all pay taxes. So our country can afford better education, better roads, better health care, a better future for our children, better whatever our tax dollars support. At some point my business could be worth millions-billions of $$$$. It is not necessarily greed George. If that’s what drives you that’s your business. But maybe I LOVE what I’m doing and the bonus is that my business is successful and able to contribute tax $$ to society. It’s possible. Don’t automatically brand every large or successful business or corporation as greedy. There may be some envy in play here too??

 
 
Edited by rum, 2020-02-28 15:03:07

You know, I keep hearing China, China, China. Whatever we do won't matter because China's not doing anything. I got news for you: China is doing a lot!  
How many electric cars does China have on the road? How many electric Car companies does China currently have? Have you heard of the Chinese green wall? Green cities? China is doing much more than Canada, But they just don't sabotage their market at the same time. They don't insist on banning one product before they have the replacement. There are more green technology advances coming out of China than Canada or the USA.  
Don't get me wrong, I'm not pro-China, but they are having a bigger positive impact than Canada or the USA are having. Just because they are still building coal plants doesn't mean they aren't doing anything.  
 
We should have a similar mindset. Build the pipeline, we need them. Build natural gas power plants. But also build solar panels, roofs, electric cars, improve recycling methods, build and operate sustainable. There is no need to shut down the oil industry. Nor is there a need for an all-carbon tax. We will get to our target faster with a strong economy that allows innovation to take place.

The more Natural Gas China burns, The less coal they will burn. Maybe they will burn both, but both are better than only coal. Their energy needs will continue to grow, do you want them to build another 20 coal plants in the next year or would it be better if those plants would be Natural Gas. If Canada can supply China with Natural Gas for 20 new plants that would otherwise have been coal, that would be a significant reduction in greenhouse gas from China with the help of Canada. Canada could benefit financially, reinvest in greener technology. The quickest way to reduce greenhouse gas is supply the greener alternatives.