Discussions

If you're serious about protesting, the first step should be education: learn about the issues, learn what is wrong and what is right, and learn about options and the way our government works. The best way to do this is to read books: the worst, to follow links in Facebook. Once you have an understanding of the issues, you will be able to effectively protest.

just because someone made a meme, doesn''t mean it''s true either. It''s so easy to make a meme about anything.  
 
I could make a meme about Trudeau dumping deadly Dihydrogen Monoxide into our water and people will believe it.  
 
It's so easy to get people riled up over nothing on social media.  
 
 
 
 
 
Dihydrogen Monoxide =: H2O =: water  
 
Edited by Trevor B, 2018-12-27 18:15:42

Read books. Lots of books. And once you think you're read enough, read a couple more. I've read a lot of books, and the more I read the more I realize I need to read more.  
 
I find that if I only learn of issues on the Internet, the self-selecting bias tends to lead me deeper and deeper into the rabbit hole, to the dark place where only anger, suspicion and conspiracy lurks. Books, while not bias-free, seems to help break that cycle and gives an overall healthier, balanced overview.  
 
I think it's really important to understand how our political system got to where it is by understanding history. Actual history, not angry-Facebook-meme history. There's an excellent little series of books in the public library by a man originally from Oak Lake named Whitcomb that lays out the history of the prairie provinces. I found them extremely helpful, giving insight into the mechanisms at work during the formation of those provinces that continues to resonate to today. From there, you'll need to branch out into examining things like the role Orangemen had in the development of this country, the Manitoba School Question on insight into the development of immigration and minority rights in this province, and the history of the railroad. Because yes, those all play into the current systems being protested by the Yellow Vests in one way or another.  
 
Additionally, people should take note that science is saying we read books differently then we read screens. We tend to only skim the Internet, but we're more likely to read deeply for content when reading a book.  
 
Happy Reading!

If Ontario GDP is higher than the entire west combined, why dies it get equalization payments at all? They should be sending to Alberta??

Even if a province is into the red, this does not affect that province's total GDP. Ontario's GDP is huge, nearly 40% of Canada's GDP. This is because vastly more people live there.  
 
Now, GDP per capita (the province's total GDP divided by its population) breakdown is as follows:  
 
$78k - Alberta  
$59k - Ontario  
$53k - Manitoba  
 
So the takeaway here is that while Ontario demolishes Alberta in overall GDP, at the individual level things are a little different. Nearly 20k difference. Per person. Now, this is really kind of a gross simplification, but this disparity at the individual level is basically why Alberta currently makes equalization payments and why Ontario is currently receiving them.  
 
As for the specifics of equalization, that's a whole other can of worms that almost certainly deserves its own topic.

Just because you saw a Facebook post saying immigrants make 3x the amount as pensioners, doesn't mean it's true.  
 
We average a spending of 276 billion on social programs (such as social assistance and pension programs) per year. MAYBE, we should look at cracking down on those who abuse social assistance programs, could actually work, etc., and relocate those funds to better train people? Put these people into the jobs that these so called immigrants are taking.  
 
I found this article kind of interesting on where our tax dollars go.  
 
https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/tax-dollars-1.4545415

made it sound like the Rally is this Saturday, like tomorrow. I believe its Saturday Jan 5?? Well that's the invite i got?

the rest of the world isn't going green.  
In 2017 over 1600 new coal powered power plants being constructed.  
In 1965 so called green energy ( before the name was known) contributed to 1% of Canadas GDP.  
Today it isn't even 2%.  
pretty plain that it is not high priorority.

Know how many of these plants are being built in North America? Zero. Not even one. Not in Canada, not in the United States, nor in Mexico.  
 
(There was one planned a couple years back in Wyoming, but that was shuttered because the guy behind it was caught scamming money from the government.)  
 
Looking at energy production through the lens of GDP is a little disingenuous. But to play your game of GDP: agriculture, forestry, fishing and hunting comprises only about 1.5% of Canada's GDP.  
 
Yes, China is building a bunch of coal plants. Well over a thousand of that 1600 number you're touting is China alone. But, as my elders were fond of asking, "if all your friends were jumping off a cliff, would you jump too?"  
 
In a province where hydro electric power is one of the primary exports, and also powers something like 97% of the province, compared to coal, where the only plant in the province is the one at the east end of town (and they only ever fire it up occasionally to make sure it still works okay in case of emergencies), choosing coal as your hill to die on seems a little out of place.

Coal plant east of town is declared as emergency only we mainly use natural gas turbines beside it now. I remember when did tour there couple years ago they said it was in process of eliminating it https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/local/brandon-coal-plant-has-3-years-left-392393891.html  
That article is a bit old but says it is done operations in 2019.  
Kind of off topic.  
 
In terms of the yellow vest protests ours are an insult to France's which actually seems to have plans of what to do rather then simply a list of things they don't want.

http://anti-racistcanada.blogspot.com/2018/12/far-right-canadian-yellow-vest.html

How do you really feel?

I would say that the yellow vest thing doesn't really cry a cause. In fact there are camps of yellow vesters that are protesting on opposite causes. It may have been about immigration and taxes and oil. It is now expanding to include... well anything.  
 
Which is the problem with just throwing on generic safety gear. I think a nologo protest is a waste of metabolic energy. It is a hidden cause; too easily cloaked onto ANY cause. There are no defined opposition groups; so you have no way to differentiate from your competition.  
 
If you really want to cause confusion, just stand there with an orange vest holding up a sign promoting road safety.

I agree with this well written post.

In reference to "your" intelligent conversation, I have a question. How is what you are saying referring to having an intelligent conversation? When all I got from your opinion is your degradation of others opinions. I respect your right to express yourself, but how was what you said constructive and adding intelligence to the conversation. Have you provided an alternative solution to the general discussion? I think not.  
 
I have read quite a few responses and some I agree with and others I disagree with, however I respect them all without prejudice, we are all entitled to our opinion whether others think its right or wrong.  
 
Edited by ChristineS., 2019-01-01 18:11:12

the most part this "protest" is nothing more than anti-Liberal, anti-Trudeau, pro-conservative rants. Want election reform because their party didn't get elected and are not in power.  
 
The major part in how politics are now is us, the electorate. We are divided into right-wing conservative and left-wing liberal hence strictly vote along those lines. Political parties know that people will vote solely on party lines, not political policy. Conservatives vote strictly for Conservative candidates and liberals vote for Liberal candidates. Getting rid of political parties won't change a thing, conservatives will still vote for conservative minded candidates and liberal will vote for liberal minded candidates.

since the polarization is more important than the issues (and the illusion of progress), politicians have learned/will continue to learn that they can hide in the sweet spot of partisan politics - collecting a salary and having power without having responsibility because of "the other guy". This will continue to make our political system/country more and more dysfunctional. Remedy: get past partisan politics, and all citizens get educated (from reasonable sources) on the issues.

I disagree that the desire for election reform is because their party didn't get elected. I think most conservatives are fairly confident that Trudeau will loose the next election, reform or no reform.  
 
I do agree with the idea that people would still vote according to their value even with election reform. That's the way it should be. People with conservative viewpoints would continue to vote for the person with the most conservative values. People with Liberal viewpoints would continue to vote for the person with the most Liberal values. That is okay.  
 
Now I wish that whoever started the yellow vest protest in Canada, would have stayed with a single issue, and not attach a list. It should have remained as a protest against Tax (The carbon tax here in Canada).

Well put i agree with all your statments

I have followed, with interest, the various rants, complaints and generalizations posted within this thread. I believe there are likely good minds and points on both sides of the issue but they tend to get drowned out by the extremes on either end of the spectrum who resort to name calling or inaccurate generalizations. Hopefully peaceful debate can continue using facts, logic and decorum.

Hmm, beyond causing something of a problem on the trans-Canada, what exactly is this convoy hoping to achieve? I can't make myself believe that either the Provincial or Federal Governments will take even the remotest notice. Perhaps its the feeling that, "at least we're doing something"?  
The original Yellow Vest protest in France was over the introduction of additional tax on diesel fuel introduced by the French Government. As diesel fueled cars are a high proportion of the total number of cars, and many rural car owners bought these vehicles for the better fuel economy, it was viewed by these owners as a "tax on the countryside car owner"  
It was also viewed "as the last straw!" in the generally held belief that, "the rich are getting richer, and the poor are getting poorer" and may would say they are right!  
I guess its not really so much about taxation as more about how incomes at the bottom end haven't really increased over the last few decades, at least in real terms. Manufacturing has in many cases come down to squeezing every last cent of profit from every conceivable source. From the transfer of manufacturing of whatever to countries where labor is cheaper. To ever cheaper materials at expense of quality, and using fiscal shenanigans to increase executive bonus whilst paying works the barest minimum. Does politics have a role in this? I don't know. Does globalization have any part in this? Almost certainly!

What is the actual route these trucks are taking through Brandon? In from Kemnay?

route is in this link  
 
https://www.westmanjournal.com/news/local-news/yellow-vest-protest-set-for-westman-saturday-1.23566092

Just wondering is anyone has seen the convoy yet. Here at Victoria Avenue and haven't seen it yet. Been here since 12pm

It does seem like a rather vague, random list of things to protest. After the protest, what happens? Hard to make a tangible difference if one casually put together group has too many agendas.  
I always worry about a group who is against ANY type of censorship - does that mean that they would be okay with speech/ writing/ actions that go against human rights (ie- they would be okay with homophobic/ racist/ transphobic/ sexist/ ageist/ etc writing/ speeches/ etc?)

He's not saying that we should be building coal powered plants. What he is trying to point out is that nothing we do in Canada, least of all Trudeau's Carbon Tax, will make even the slightest bit of difference on a global scale, because our carbon footprint is miniscule by comparison. All Trudeau is attempting to do is look good on the world stage so he can go to more dress-up parties and further embarass Canadians. Its a joke.

I just saw the convoy about 10mins ago coming down from kemney.

I agree its just someone jumping on a bandwagon and using it to further their issues. IMO they are racist, biggoted and don’t see us as a country working together but want us regionalized. Instead of protesting about immigration or free speech perhaps take a course, read a book. Seems they are more like Trumpsters here!

How is being pro pipeline racist and bigoted? The Yellow vest umbrella has certainly grown to i:nclude many grievances but this is predominantly a prop pipeline action.

Pro pipeline, not prop pipeline. Site will not let me edit post.