Discussions

Trevor probably meant the area was an area where there were few income earners to pay the taxes. After all this bridge really only served a populated area of less than 1000.  
 
Anyway the sun has come up today and life will go on. City council had a difficult but obvious decision to make and they made the right one.

how many hundreds of thousands$$ of taxpayer dollars are being thrown at downtown Brandon, by the city, under Renaissance Brandon, BEEP, or Brandon Neighborhood Renewal Corp., and countless other business-enticing grants, to get people to live and work there? Then, an important link to and from the downtown will be demolished? Since when do 'low income' property owners not pay taxes? (unless they live downtown?) No I don't live north of the bridge, but, Reggie 2, are those folks the only ones who used it? I used to use 8th Street.......

Reggie 2 said "Trevor probably meant the area was an area where there were few income earners to pay the taxes. After all this bridge really only served a populated area of less than 1000.     Anyway the sun has come up today and life will go on. City council had a difficult but obvious decision to make and they made the right one. "

that anyone that owns a home or business down in the flats pays their taxes. And I know that the tax bills across the city bring in a fair chunk of change.  
 
It's unfortunate that Mayor Chrest and this council will wear this. Too bad previous mayors and councils didn't sock away cash every budget to deal with the possibility of replacing the 8th. street bridge. Perhaps the reason was the previous elected leaders didn't want to replace the structure.  
 
Reggie, lol, where's the sun?  
 
The only positive is that the city has 2 million? in reserve for the demolition.

Cannot believe what you said. Only high income areas of the city should be looked after??  
Kind of think the city council had that train of thought also.  
So why would even think of a pedestrian bridge?? Does that mean that the north end people don't have vehicles and only need to walk downtown?? What good does it do to walk across the bridge?  
Nothing there as far as I'm concerned!  
 
Wonderful when those new baseball diamonds get going and there is a major tournament, traffic should be fun.  
Oh, but wait! People can use that pedestrian bridge to get there!  
 
Really a sad situation imo.

I wish this bridge would be repaired to drive on, but that is only my opinion! A crossing area is needed here regardless, people can't be walking over the tracks because trains sit in this area for hours at a time. Of course, if it doesn't affect the people in charge of making this decision then of course they will not care as much as someone who would benefit from this. If they built a new bridge to drive on, it could last the next 100 years as the one before it!

A 9-1 vote in favor of demolishing the 8th Street bridge Monday night at the Brandon City Council meeting.  
 
http://www.cklq.com/index.php?id=62&tx_ttnews%5Btt_news%5D=10726&cHash=fb1cb5f3ab5301a9623bf969b32eb0de

At ll million dollars.....which when all said and done would be more like 15-20 million as when has anything in this province ever come at or under budget.....Is a large chunk of money for a small amount of people. There is what, roughly 20 blocks of an area that would potentially use a walking bridge regularly? I would like to know what the foot population has been since it closed. Are their hoards of people crossing this bridge on a daily basis? Looking at Winnipeg there isn't pedestrian bridges going over all the tracks where yards are. There is roughly the same span to drive or walk to your destination. Why is one in Brandon so needed?

I feel if the upper class residents of Brookwood can have double wide streets which have been paid by all the taxpayers of Brandon, then surely a new bridge is in order. Maybe we can upscale the project and cover it with a roof for pedestrian traffic.

ks said "I feel if the upper class residents of Brookwood can have double wide streets which have been paid by all the taxpayers of Brandon, then surely a new bridge is in order. Maybe we can upscale the project and cover it with a roof for pedestrian traffic. "

I assume you are referring to Brookwood Dr. A nice wide street for the "upper class" (your words) people of Brandon to enjoy. While I'm not 100% sure, I expect the developer paid for that street when the development was built and the cost of that street was passed on to the folks that bought homes in that area.  
 
I have to wonder how acceptable a new bridge would be if Brandon's cost of said bridge was determined, as well, the ratio of use between local residents and other traffic just getting from point A to point B was determined. Then, an appropriate and very real number was attached to the cost of upgrading the bridge for use by local residents. A local improvement tax could be added to the property taxes of area residents over the next 20 years for that portion, and the taxpayers at large could pick up the rest of the bill.  
 
I don't see a plan like that gaining much traction from the local residents that want the bridge the most.  
 
If you look at crossings in Winnipeg, in most cases you have to travel a considerably farther distance to access a river or elevated train crossing.  
 
I'll agree that a traffic bridge in that area would be convenient, but we also need to live within our means, personally as well as all levels of government.

What I'm saying is that $30 Million plus would be quite a hit that would be added to property taxes. And the low-income earners would feel that effect much more.  
 

Trevor B said "What I'm saying is that $30 Million plus would be quite a hit that would be added to property taxes. And the low-income earners would feel that effect much more.     "

As a single parent , paying a mortgage in this area. Im so glad that the bridge is going, really no way that i would wanna pay extra taxes for a bridge the area doesnt need at all.

next time you are up on the 18th street bridge , look to the east , my god you could throw a stone and reach half ways to the furthest homes in that direction,and you want the rest of Brandon to help fund a new bridge, And the prices are ridiculous, I sure hope whatever is done goes out on tenders because I would like a shot at that, Even a simple demolition will make someone a few bucks

Why don't they spend the two million to knock down to just refurbish the bridge for pedestrians. People are going to be going across the tracks and get hurt.

can also get charged with trespassing! I believe CP has a fence all along the south side anyways.

misswinter said "Why don't they spend the two million to knock down to just refurbish the bridge for pedestrians. People are going to be going across the tracks and get hurt. "

It's clear that some sort of pedestrian option is needed. It's a pretty hefty haul on foot from DT without an 8th street crossing.  
 
People will def. get hurt/arrested/whatever shortcutting across the tracks if nothing is there.

Blue_Guru said "    misswinter said "Why don't they spend the two million to knock down to just refurbish the bridge for pedestrians. People are going to be going across the tracks and get hurt. " It's clear that some sort of pedestrian option is needed. It's a pretty hefty haul on foot from DT without an 8th street crossing.     People will def. get hurt/arrested/whatever shortcutting across the tracks if nothing is there. "

How many pedestrian crossing is there between 1st st and 17th st east across the other major rail line (yard) in Brandon? Is there a fence on either side of that rail line?

We don't need to spend millions on Dog parks, pretty flower pots and excessive spending on unnecessary city employees and equipment.

This bridge shouldn't be replaced at all. It only services to ppl within that area with a small population vs the rest of the city.  
 
Waste of money spent on any type of replacement.

The 8th St bridge serviced more areas than just the North End residents. I live in the East End and used the 8th St bridge on a regular basis to get to businesses, work etc. I also know the ambulance & fire personnel used that bridge frequently! Now to get to my house or anywhere East of 8th St. they will have to negotiate 18th St traffic (and from other posts on here, not everyone pulls over and stops) or 26th St? Minutes in an emergency are crucial but I guess our lives aren't as important as the people who live west of 18th! Sounds like we are creating our own "Perimeter -itis"!

Worst decision made yet by the city of Brandon!!! First the Casino....now this??? WTF? wake up people  
 
this pathetic city will never change or grow for that matter. all these negative ppl here don't want anything new and if we actually do get something, everyone complains the whole time  
 
wish everyone would just get with times and make this city something great!!! not just being stuck in the same old rut as always  
 
really disappointed once again  

Accident on 18th St bridge (which is a common occurrence during winter), train on 26th St (another common occurrence). Precious moments for the ambulance to fight their way to get to victims (yes I know dept is right there but need to get vehicles off the bridge to get to scene.)  
 
Now what?? Back down to Kirkaldy and over to 1st?  
 
All I know is moments can be precious when life is on the line. And it may even be someone who lives south of the bridge!

lovetooshop said "Accident on 18th St bridge (which is a common occurrence during winter), train on 26th St (another common occurrence). Precious moments for the ambulance to fight their way to get to victims (yes I know dept is right there but need to get vehicles off the bridge to get to scene.)     Now what?? Back down to Kirkaldy and over to 1st?     All I know is moments can be precious when life is on the line. And it may even be someone who lives south of the bridge! "

Let's do a better scenario. Tell us how many times there has been an accident on 18th plus a train blocking 26th and emergency unable to respond from 13th st station. Chances are if there is an accident on 18th that fire hall would be on site. The other hall would be dispatched. What have we been doing all this time now being out of operations?

Fishin Guy said "    lovetooshop said "Accident on 18th St bridge (which is a common occurrence during winter), train on 26th St (another common occurrence). Precious moments for the ambulance to fight their way to get to victims (yes I know dept is right there but need to get vehicles off the bridge to get to scene.)     Now what?? Back down to Kirkaldy and over to 1st?     All I know is moments can be precious when life is on the line. And it may even be someone who lives south of the bridge! " Let's do a better scenario. Tell us how many times there has been an accident on 18th plus a train blocking 26th and emergency unable to respond from 13th st station. Chances are if there is an accident on 18th that fire hall would be on site. The other hall would be dispatched. What have we been doing all this time now being out of operations? "

Fishin guy good that you remind everybody that there is a firehall with an ambulance and fire trucks on 13 th. Everyone seems to think that the north end firehall is the only one in the city with these scare tactics

Just wait and see, how much it will cost the city to pull down this bridge, first. Before anyone starts promising anything else. This Dillion Consulting (AKA the "advising engineering firm"), who has been billing the Brandon taxpayers for years, has "recommended" that the bridge be removed in three out of it's four narrowed minded proposals. At an estimated cost of 2.3 million (from four years ago). And why wouldn't they? ...for the probability of more future engineering work. Even without an replacement structure, the "expertise" from them would be required for the demolition process. Win, win, win, win, for these people in any decision. It's now just how big of a win they can they convince the city council. It's like having only one mechanic in a town far up north who's also owns the only car lot as well. "Well, I can continue to fix your car or you can buy another one through me. What'cha want to do?" "Now, keep in mind no one else is going to help you to get rid of it, properly, if you decide that you don't want it anymore." ...Wow, such wonderful options available (sarcasm).  
 
I feel that right from the beginning, the four options were very limited. Like the fact that the option to convert the bridge to pedestrian use only was never properly explored. I know there's a few holes in the decking and sidewalk, but I wonder if doing a few repairs and adding the fact there's neither any more traveling vehicle stress or corrosive road salt on it, wouldn't have been considered an option? These engineers do have all the needed numbers to make that an option. Right???? I know it's crumbling a little, but it's not like it's a threat to the public safety or the railway. Can anyone prove to us that in the past or in the near future, large chunks of concrete are coming down? Even if it does/would, I've seen chain-linked netting hung under a structure to prevent that from being a danger. So what gives??? Why wasn't this an option? Because, from what I can see ...this not that bad if no one drives on it. Just patch up the bad spots, add some better lighting and change out the guard rails with some hand rails and climb-proof fencing on both sides. Done! We now have a pedestrian bridge before the end of summer and for a lot less than tearing it down and/or building something new. And how did these engineers pull an number like nine million out of thin air for a new, custom built foot bridge over the tracks? ...For Christ sake! Souris built their "swinging bridge" from nothing two years ago at only a cost of 4.5 million. And it's a fancy sucker that needed a completely different engineering perspective to be done than that of the usually used standard supported concrete structure. Is Brandon just getting fleeced by these people? Or does it really cost double to build over a railway, then over a river? If that's the case, why wasn't there and option to span over the river towards First street, instead of this crazy obsessive quest to connect to Pacific Avenue?  
 
Ya know, I've been saying for years, that it would be cheaper, easier, faster process to place a leveled vehicle bridge over the river to Dinsdale park. Wow, another option that should have been considered in the last four years (along with 26th street and 34th street or further out crossing options that should of been presented as possibilities to the city).  
 
So, I have mixed feelings about our city councils decisions. On one hand... I'm sort of glad a decision process has been made and action is finally to begin. Plus, the fact that a massive expense was diverted by delaying the decision on building any new structures. On the other hand, I feel no effort was made in solving anything with regards serving the cities current problems and growing pains were done. Nor, do I believe our council ever given all the options or facts to provide the best civic plans for the future accessibility and traffic flow throughout our city.  
 
I personally believe that the near unanimous vote in taking down that bridge was premature and ill-informed. I'm sooo disappointed in the lack of vision & imagination from Dillion Consulting and our cities civic planning. The inability for council to ask better questions or to request more information with regards for more options. And for the lack of enthusiasm of everyone's part here in Brandon over the last four years to push to get anything started. I think many are going to be surprised to find out how much effort and cost will be required to take down something that could have easily been re-purposed for less.  
 
Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

The estimated price for Brandon's bridge sounds pretty reasonable. I don't think you can compare a pillarless suspension bridge like in Souris to a bridge that will require several support pillars.  
 
http://www.rmwb.ca/Page4165.aspx  
 
Fort Edmonton Footbridge (Edmonton) 2008-2010 246m*5m $22,900,000  
Peace Bridge (Calgary) 2010-2012 126m*6.2m $19,800,000  
St. Patrick’s Island (Calgary) 2012-2014 180x6 (average width) $24,000,000  
Esplanade Riel (Winnipeg) 2003  -2004 250m*5m $14,000,000  
Hangingstone Pedestrian Bridge  2012-2014 63m*3m $4,800,000  
(Fort McMurray)  
MacDonald Island Bridge (Fort McMurray) 2013-2015 230m*5m $40,000,000 (estimated)  

ultraguy said "The estimated price for Brandon's bridge sounds pretty reasonable. I don't think you can compare a pillarless suspension bridge like in Souris to a bridge that will require several support pillars.     http://www.rmwb.ca/Page4165.aspx     Fort Edmonton Footbridge (Edmonton) 2008-2010 246m*5m $22,900,000   Peace Bridge (Calgary) 2010-2012 126m*6.2m $19,800,000   St. Patrick’s Island (Calgary) 2012-2014 180x6 (average width) $24,000,000   Esplanade Riel (Winnipeg) 2003  -2004 250m*5m $14,000,000   Hangingstone Pedestrian Bridge  2012-2014 63m*3m $4,800,000   (Fort McMurray)   MacDonald Island Bridge (Fort McMurray) 2013-2015 230m*5m $40,000,000 (estimated)   "

I think 11 million to replace the bridge is a little high. I am curious to how many tenders this came from. Looking at the other bridges like Winnipeg and other cities these bridges span much further over a river. I was searching a little and seen other bridges in calgary and others for 6 around the 6 million mark. We don't need something fancy, futuristic looking, stained wood appeal. Give some metal simple bridge with a metal grating floor and call it a day.

i believe a pedestrian bridge would be a mistake as it is about a third of the cost of what is needed, much talk of the low number of people living in the area , no thought to the people that work in the twenty or so businesses that are in the area. many feel that the first street bridge will take some of the traffic that 8th street used to, if you took time to look at a map you may understand that is not possible . the pedestrian bridge is not a good choice,i am sure that a lot advocating it have never walked across the bridge in the winter, unprotected enough that a slight breeze is nasty.

Fishin Guy said "    ultraguy said "The estimated price for Brandon's bridge sounds pretty reasonable. I don't think you can compare a pillarless suspension bridge like in Souris to a bridge that will require several support pillars.     http://www.rmwb.ca/Page4165.aspx     Fort Edmonton Footbridge (Edmonton) 2008-2010 246m*5m $22,900,000   Peace Bridge (Calgary) 2010-2012 126m*6.2m $19,800,000   St. Patrick’s Island (Calgary) 2012-2014 180x6 (average width) $24,000,000   Esplanade Riel (Winnipeg) 2003  -2004 250m*5m $14,000,000   Hangingstone Pedestrian Bridge  2012-2014 63m*3m $4,800,000   (Fort McMurray)   MacDonald Island Bridge (Fort McMurray) 2013-2015 230m*5m $40,000,000 (estimated)   " I think 11 million to replace the bridge is a little high. I am curious to how many tenders this came from. Looking at the other bridges like Winnipeg and other cities these bridges span much further over a river. I was searching a little and seen other bridges in calgary and others for 6 around the 6 million mark. We don't need something fancy, futuristic looking, stained wood appeal. Give some metal simple bridge with a metal grating floor and call it a day. "

Like where? I know of the Shaganappi bridge in Calgary which was around $6M, but that bridge is only 58m long. Brandon would need one closer to 150m. And that one is a pretty basic bridge.  
 
 
 
Edited by ultraguy, 2016-04-06 16:15:30

also includes the demolition of the old bridge, roughly $2 million.  
 
Since there are no designs done for a pedestrian bridge yet. It's hard to say what the actual price would be.  
 

Like where? I know of the Shaganappi bridge in Calgary which was around $6M, but that bridge is only 58m long. Brandon would need one closer to 150m. And that one is a pretty basic bridge.  
 
I don't think we would need a long bridge due to not needing the slope of the current road. Sure if you span a bridge from Pacific to Stickney it is like 200m. But from Pacific to Assiniboine Ave is only 100m. Cambridge has a box bridge 102m for a whopping 1.025 million dollars  
So if I took that price per meter and went with 150m it is around 1.5 million. Highway 401 pedestrian bridge, 101.5m cost of 1.7 million. So even after the 2 million to destroy old bridge leaving 9 million for new bridge seems pretty high when other places can build a simple bridge for a couple million.