Discussions

The review ruled it wasn't assault. The phone wasn't even damaged but lets make the city replace it. Wow.  
 
The officer lied. The department will review the incident and will more than likely be some discipline, up to possible termination. But could we stick to that? Some wouldn't be happy until the cop was tortured and thrown in jail, and the victim given $10 million and a personal apology from Justin Trudeau!

Going as far as saying the lady should file a lawsuit against the city(which the tax payer will pick up the bill for) is a little far fetched. Ya she was ''man handled'' and her phone was thrown on the floor by the officer and then the officer lied about what happen, which makes the situation worse, but she wasn't beaten to a pulp. Lets not get too carried away, this isn't the US.  
 
Edited by The_Young_Man, 2016-07-05 16:51:21

Before anyone jumps on my head... I don't know the "full story", but neither does anyone else on eBrandon. However, our society is full of judgmental, critical hypocrites who squawk during any beneficial opportunity in order to take advantage and to put down others. Just look at most of these posts! Squawk. Squawk. Squawk. None of us was there, none of us know what statements were made from the parties involved and no one has seen the video. All we have is a incredibly brief statement given from the Independent Investigation Unit of Manitoba stating that "the actions of the subject office were uncalled (for) and unjustified". But concluded with "Discretion is warranted and no charges will be authorized against the subject officer". Plus, the CBC article stated recommendations were suggested from the IIU that "The Brandon Police Service may wish to determine whether further internal actions are warranted to deal with the officer's conduct". Translation: The cop was in the wrong to use excessive force and lied in his statements on how the event took place, but was not excessive enough to be criminal charged by the courts. However, it's been recommended that his superiors should continue or have additional disciplinary actions put upon that cop. So if "Joe Public" wants more answers... It's up to the public (hopefully the news media) to get an statement from the Brandon Police on what will be done or have been done to address this matter. So stop bashing the cops, people!  
 
I've often told my kids to be anything they want for a career as long it wasn't these two things: Soldier and cop. Society never respects either profession, until after the fact. And that's so true. With soldiers, they get labeled as dumb, aggressive "meat heads" seeking benefits from our government *snark*, but get defined as "heroes" when the arrive home tired and broken. Wow, that was a quick flip. And even quicker flip happens within a year when everyone soon forgets. And cops are often classified as soulless public service enforcers of the law who are viewed by many as having a "superior complex" on demanding respect of their authority of the law. But, the public will immediately change their minds whenever the media singles out an "exceptional moment" or whenever one gets killed on duty. GOD! We're awful! We are constantly hating the police long after from whenever we knowingly break the rules and get caught. We suspect & accuse the police afterwards that they are on some kind of emotional power trip, then criticize them on everything they do and should be doing with regards to their job. Then as the topper, do a complete 180 when we actually need them or wanting them to abandon the law when it's convenient or beneficial for us. ...such hypocrites the all of us! We hold them to such high standards, scrutinize, then complain when things don't go "our way". The pressure and mistrust from both sides (the general public and the officer), makes me think that this is truly the most thankless job in the city. Always on our "beck and call" whenever someone is unhappy... it must suck to feel that the only ones they can count on, is each other.  
 
Don't get me wrong. I'm not turning a blind eye to this officers poor actions with the aggressive restrainment and then lied about it. That mark will always be tagged to his career records and will definitely affect his future as a policeman. But cut these people some slack for going off on people like her with these $h!+ calls. And that's what is was... A $h!+ call. The classic "domestic disturbance/violence complaint", where everyone is upset, everyone has a different story and usually the only reason the cops are called is not to serve justice... but to do someones bidding out of spite. I know I couldn't handle the daily task of playing the so-called victims pawn over and over again. Someone wants immediate retaliation and vengeance put upon another, so the cops are called to hopefully do just that. And then when they don't... the victim turns on the cops with bitter verbal abuse and disrespect. Too bad the video had no audio. It would explain what "set off" this cop and what prompted him to do what he did. The article stated she was on her phone trying to leave while he was talking (lecturing) to her. Ahh yes, the typical "princess attitude" of ignoring the people she called to attention and making a huff because her expectations weren't met. I'm pretty sure we've all had those people in our lives. They expect others to do their dirty work. Get angry when we don't. Then get rude while you try to explain. How many times have we gotten miffed when the person you're talking to, pulls out a bloody phone and focuses on that instead. Or you get a childish reaction on a serious discussion when that person decides to walk away in mid conversation. Jeez, I wonder if those were the triggers? (*sarcasm*) It's such crap that so much of our police resources are wasted when dealing with such trivial complaints as non-serious domestic complaints only to have professional advise or solutions fall on deaf ears.  
 
Maybe I just see things differently. Like, wondering why the cop went off on this chick instead of just assuming that whatever the circumstances... If the cop is proven wrong, the other person is automatically innocent of everything done prior to and during the incident. Perhaps, all parties involved should a behaved better?  
 
Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

I don't think anyone's bashing them. Their discussing what they think about a cop being busted for lying. Have people forgotten he lied and tried to cover it up?? That's the main issue here I think. Abuse and phone throwing as well but the fact he lied is really unsettling. Makes u wonder about them and howany others will. People can't blame us for not trusting cops..especially since finally soemthing has came out public. I personally have been waiting for this day. I know lots of people who have bad encounters and have been scared to say anything. This is why. Bad message to send to kids and I hope it is fixed accordingly and he is fired.

So no one had a problem with our prime minister walking across the floor of the house of Commons grabbing a conservative mp and elbowing a ndp member of parlament but heaven forbid a police officer in a high stress situation do something similar. Hipocryts. Both were wrong both deserve to be disiplend. How can we expect better of our police if we do not expect it of the leader of our country

the whole story isn't said to me and let's not put the entire police force in the hole, some cops are good and deserve not be hit on the head.  
If the girl sues well hope the judge won't let that happen because she is only trying for extra cash which will all of us paying for it (city money means all of us).

This is what the Brandon Police said about the incident according to the Brandon Sun.  
 
Quote:  
"We respect the independence of the IIU, their investigative process, and the conclusion made respecting this investigation. Matters of this nature are taken very seriously by the Brandon Police Service. As noted in their release, there are other avenues for the complainant to pursue, should she wish to do so. As always, the Police Service will completely cooperate with any further investigations by any other recognized agency. Any internal investigations and possible resulting action are an employer–employee matter and the Police Service will not release any further information concerning this,” read the statement.  
 
Not much of a statement. And from the sounds of it the police service did cooperate will the investigation and gave the IIU a copy of the surveillance video and file material and the Brandon Police service was the one who contacted the Independent Investigation Unit after the incident.  
 
Link to article  
http://www.brandonsun.com/breaking-news/No-criminal-charges-to-be-laid-in-alleged-assault-involving-BPS-officer-385466841.html?thx=:y  
 
Edited by The_Young_Man, 2016-07-05 20:41:42

It said in brandon sun I'm sure that he refused to talk but his lawyer advised him to. I'm sure that's what it said but I could be off on which report I read that. Police said something yes...didn't do much..very sad situation.

You are bang on and thank u.

OneMan'sOpinion said "I found the CBC report more than a little biased. Here is the link to the IIU report:     http://iiumanitoba.ca/pdf/final_report_jul4_2016_police_assault.pdf     Read it for yourself and then make your own informed conclusion rather than just getting on here and cop bashing. The BPS website also has a release and it says that further investigations may occur depending on whether the woman wants to make a complaint. I'm assuming that means LERA.     In my opinion, this is far from done. "

I read the report and don't agree with the conclusion. Police officers should be held to a higher standard than ordinary citizens as they ARE the face of the law to the public.  
 
In this case, the officer committed assault as defined by the criminal code. The police exemption does not apply as the force used was not necessary to perform his duties. In addition, the officer lied in an official statement about what happened.  
 
Let's face it... if any other male got in an argument with a woman and pushed her around like that and a complaint was made, there would be criminal charges. This officer should . be . charged.  
 
Cops like that are what give entire police forces bad names. This guy is a bully, plain and simple, and does not deserve to wear a uniform. If they don't charge him, they should fire him, because what happens next time? What if there is no camera to contradict his lies? Prune the diseased branches so the tree can grow healthy and lush.

In today's multi-media age where a lot of people make judgements without knowing all the facts, is frightening. The only fact that we do know, is that we don't know all the facts. But let’s hang this cop out to dry, let's fire him, and let's not trust any cops ever again. Let's record every encounter with cops because they are all evil. Give me a break!  
 
So...here is a scenario. This is just hypothetical and is not real in any way. Let's say a female phones police to report that she was assault. Police attend and find this complainant highly intoxicated. There are four males subjects in the apartment playing cards. All have been drinking but the female is intoxicated. She says her x-boyfriend assault her. All the others in the suite say she is the problem and she got the black eye last night in a bar fight and she was not assaulted by the x. They say that she is just mad because they drank all her booze. Police try to talk to the female and wonder why she always invites these guys to her suite and drinking all night. The female becomes uncooperative because the police aren't taking the man to jail. She pulls out a phone and says she is going to record the conversation with police. The officer says polity, mam, please don't record me. She sticks the phone in his face. He asks again to remove the phone but she drunkenly holds it up to his face again. He grabs the phone and throws it to the floor. She now decides she is going to her neighbor’s suite. The cop says politely, mam your drunk and your neighbors don't want you there. She goes to walk passed the officer who grabs her by the sweater and pulls her back. She is belligerent and swearing now. She tries to walk passed the officer again and he holds her back against the wall. This officer is well trained and highly versed in the domestic violence policy of BPS so, even though she is uncooperative and belligerent; he takes her to the police station to get a statement from her.  
Again, I don’t know what happened and if you don’t know what happened, maybe you shouldn’t rush to judgement.  
The above scenario is hypothetical but you might be surprised as to how often these things happen. Give the Brandon Police Service a little credit and let them investigate before everyone moved to Kazakhstan where the police are honest and not violent at all.

Your situation is purely hypothetical and irrelevant to the discussion since that is not what happened. Also, people have the right to film officers. That does not give the officer the right to stop the filming and throw the phone.  
 
 
13:55:37 After some talking back and forth, AP appears to take something out of a front pocket. She looks down in front of herself, apparently at something in her hands, and SO also looks toward the same spot as he continues to talk.  
 
13:56:02 SO reaches out and takes something from AP’s hand. A cell phone is now visible in SO’s hand and he forcefully throws it to the floor behind him, where it bounces against the bottom part of the door behind him.  

a lot of comments in thread saying the cop really did not harm her and the phone works, so whats the big deal.??  
 
the deal is that if someone other than a cop grabbed your phone, threw it on the ground, then pushed you up against the wall and held you there, I suspect you would be laying assault charges against that person.  
 
so why is a cop any different.unless you show aggression, resisting arrest, or not complying with a lawful order the cop had no right to hold or even touch her or her property.  
 
If I were her I would be making every effort to have formal charges laid.  
 
as far as the officer "lecturing, yelling or belittling her". I would guess he needs more training.  
 
no wonder people have trouble trusting the police if they appear to be above the law, and the review committees that look into this matters can't make good recommendations that protect the public and the integrity of the force as a whole.

Who knows who he is and if still around out there. And it sucks for the force cuz they will take the fall for all of this. If he was smart and took any pride in his job...which he clearly can't show due to the lies and cover ups. .why not save ur team? I know he's not the only rotten apple..he's far from only one..but this is gonna affect the force for long time and turn the public away. He should step.forward. I would in his position. I wouldn't have to be made and neither should he. Keeping this behind closed doors will eventually mean it's forgotten soon. Like most other cases. Save the people u call ur family cuz it ain't looking good. He lied n lied n abused a girl...suck it up. The lies n cover up are by far the most alarming and it makes a person skeptical of them all and that's damaging and sad.it could be any one of them and that's the scary part. Fix it and notify public. It's the right thing to do. Anyone else would be named. And charged. Why not police? For public safety we should know something. ..this is sad

why are people so judging him make him he is a bad person, why not judging her too. She could had hit a person in her life or this year or be thief and he gets the slap.  
You don't know maybe he does a good job and may have slip a little this time.  
How are you in your job? Do you like be judge or slap for one mistake so why judge him. Let their station deal and judge this situation.

I make mistakes in my job. But I don't try to cover them up afterward when writing a report on the incident. That takes a conscious decision to be dishonest and is not simply a mistake.

this kind of stuff happens all the time Seen this happen at the summer fair a couple years ago and a bar in Brandon they walk up and manhandle young kids over petty things like a cell phone violation If you check the City of Brandon website for wages they are paid very well for what they do in this City If they cant treat people with respect how can they expect respect back. If I walked up to a police officer and grabbed his phone through it down , grabbed him by the shoulder what would happen to me, if this is acceptable then if I did this I should not expect to be charged with anything

ultraguy said "I make mistakes in my job. But I don't try to cover them up afterward when writing a report on the incident. That takes a conscious decision to be dishonest and is not simply a mistake. "

maybe because you know you will not get hit like cops do end up on the news and the papers.  
Even doctors (and nurses) make mistakes and don't end up on the news. I heard a pharmacist made an error and didn't end up in the papers.

Incorrect. I''m honest in my reports because I know I could be fired for intentionally misleading my superiors.  
 
I would hope that the police force has similar standards.  
 
Edited by ultraguy, 2016-07-07 13:05:25

It happens far too often and it's bs. Exactly what would they do? We'd end up manhandled and in jail with charges. That simple. This is atrocious & it says she hasn't went to LERA yet...gee I wonder why? U think she thinks their gonna help after this? Unbelievable people think this is ok or two sided. Sets the tone for the thinking in this town/police force and no one should blame anyone for not trusting authority..especially with this. This is a game changer 100% and not all cops are like that..but who knows now right? When we don't even know the cop involved.. what are we supposed to think?

Timetowakeup said "So if she has a record she doesn't deserve protection under the law? Even if she has a recorded for theft, assault or whatever, she can still be a victim! By your logic if you ever were convicted of an offence that would allow for anyone to assault you take or damage your property at will and you are not entitled to legal protection??? The worst part is still no statement! If he is not on active duty ie on leave, desk duty whatever that's good we don't need his name. If he is still active then yes his name should be released as any lawyer worth his salt would have every last one of his charges tossed! It is just sad when people don't in today's day and age don't realize that if it hints of cover up or scandal silence makes it look worse! Silence is almost like an admission in these cases, if you have nothing to hide why scared to say so? It may come down to the mayor directing a statement or an access to information request be submitted then BPS would have to release the info and probably more than they want to! "

all your twisted words I didn't stated once that she doesn't deserve protection.

The police service released a statement already. This is their statement from the Brandon Sun the other day.  
 
Quote:  
"We respect the independence of the IIU, their investigative process, and the conclusion made respecting this investigation. Matters of this nature are taken very seriously by the Brandon Police Service. As noted in their release, there are other avenues for the complainant to pursue, should she wish to do so. As always, the Police Service will completely cooperate with any further investigations by any other recognized agency. Any internal investigations and possible resulting action are an employer–employee matter and the Police Service will not release any further information concerning this,” read the statement.  
 
And lets remember the Brandon Police Service is the one who contacted the Independent Investigation Unit in the first place after the incident. So I don't think the police service is trying to cover up the incident, the officer yes and he will be dealt with im sure. The Brandon police service does conduct 'performance reviews' from time to time and does have policies in place the officers must follow, just as any police service does. Ever heard of the Disciplinary Procedures By-Law the Brandon Police Service has?  
 
Edited by The_Young_Man, 2016-07-07 20:09:20

Timetowakeup said "And so have you so maybe you can enlighten me because I seem to be unable to find the disposition of the accused while the department decides what to do? Is he still policing the public, on leave paid or other wise, or on desk duty? "

No idea and according to the statement we will never know.  
 
But you say your a retired Brandon cop, and im sure you know officers still policing...phone and ask them if its a big concern. I don't know.  
 
Edited by The_Young_Man, 2016-07-07 20:37:21

Don't be quick to judge. Domestics are the worst for police. There are 2 sides to this story, I'm sure. Maybe this person was antagonizing the officer, we don't know? Some people just should be handled rough and then maybe they'd get it!!! Maybe some would stay out of our jails!!!

This is the same old story with a twist. Most often the truth in these situations goes to what the cop says occurred (whether it is the truth or not) and as there is almost always no independent evidence the matter is over. This time there is video evidence which shows the officers version is distorted. (a soft way of saying he lied). What the Investigator Unit did in not charging the officer is shameful. He missed the point of what is the "public interest" which in this case should have been to deal with the problem officer. The police union president should also remember he also represents the vast majority of officers who don't abuse people and lie and those officers are also the losers in this incident along with the domestic victim and the people of Brandon.

tafeel said "So no one had a problem with our prime minister walking across the floor of the house of Commons grabbing a conservative mp and elbowing a ndp member of parlament but heaven forbid a police officer in a high stress situation do something similar. Hipocryts. Both were wrong both deserve to be disiplend. How can we expect better of our police if we do not expect it of the leader of our country "

Did he then get caught lying about it?  
 
What he did may have been provoked or in the heat of the moment, not making it right but the big issue is the lying.  
 
The courts take an officers word over a civilian and that is enough to put people in jail.  
 
That is a serious responsibility and a police officer needs to always tell the truth during an investigation.  
 
Would you want to go to jail because this officer lied?  
 
His credibility is shot, not because of what he did but because he lied so get him off the force as to not smear the other good officers.  
 
When all cops get a bad name with the public is when they cover up or protect scum like this telling the rest of us that they think their actions were ok. So now we think maybe they all are ok with lying. Having a bad cop does not make all cops bad but if all cops are seen to be protecting a bad one they all look bad.

Madison said "Don't be quick to judge. Domestics are the worst for police. There are 2 sides to this story, I'm sure. Maybe this person was antagonizing the officer, we don't know? Some people just should be handled rough and then maybe they'd get it!!! Maybe some would stay out of our jails!!! "

If he had a legitimate excuse for roughing up this women then why did he have to lie and cover it up, disrespecting a police officer is not a crime and if it was he doesn't get to deal out the punishment, even if she verbally threatened to kill the officer then the cuffs should have come out and an arrest made and a judge get to deal with the punishment but he lie because he knew he did wrong.one side

What I don't get is why take back the night and the ladys shelter for abused women are not in front of the police building protesting and demanding answers from the police. Make sure this cop is not doing any more domestics. Or more women will be abused. and does this abuse by cops ever happen to rich people or just disadvantaged.

ultraguy said "Your situation is purely hypothetical and irrelevant to the discussion since that is not what happened. Also, people have the right to film officers. That does not give the officer the right to stop the filming and throw the phone.       13:55:37 After some talking back and forth, AP appears to take something out of a front pocket. She looks down in front of herself, apparently at something in her hands, and SO also looks toward the same spot as he continues to talk.     13:56:02 SO reaches out and takes something from AP’s hand. A cell phone is now visible in SO’s hand and he forcefully throws it to the floor behind him, where it bounces against the bottom part of the door behind him.   "

But that's the point of the hypothetical scenario. The only fact that is known, is that we don't know exactly what happened. Yes there was a video but was the complainant drunk, belligerent, un-cooperate, abusive towards police. We don't know. Let the police do there internal investigation before any body pushes the panic button.

None of that justifies the officer's actions or dishonesty. The Independent Investigation Unit reached the same conclusion:  
 
"The impugned conduct in this instance was uncalled and unjustified. The public interest expects peace officers to exercise constraint and control over their emotions and maintain an air of professionalism at all times, particularly in dealing with purported victims of crime."  
 
Edited by ultraguy, 2016-07-08 09:54:17