Discussions

Are teachers paid in the summer for their holidays. Lots of jobs get paid holidays. Teachers also work at home after hours marking, prepping, sporting events tournaments, upgrading in the summer. Most other jobs this is called overtime. Just a comment.

gekko said "Are teachers paid in the summer for their holidays. Lots of jobs get paid holidays. Teachers also work at home after hours marking, prepping, sporting events tournaments, upgrading in the summer. Most other jobs this is called overtime. Just a comment. "

I would love to take my full wage and an only work 196 days a year. Some teachers average their pay to pay over the two months off some don't. Either way it is a salary for the year. If upgrading in the summer well going into the new year they are classified as a more qualified teacher according to some. Therefore entitled to higher wages, so I would say they get paid for it. Do all teachers work sporting events, tournaments, etc? From what I have seen there wasn't a lot of teachers that did this. Prepping and such. They are paid for a min 40 min per day Gr. 1-8 and 65 min per day for high school. Can anyone tell me that they see teachers filling this time directly to prep each and every day with undivided attention? Or how many take it home and do prep over watching tv or something in the evening? Each year they teach a lot of the same materials, the wheel isn't reinvented every year. They print off a few handouts, some have a little more, but it is pretty consistent each year. New teachers will have more prep but the longer term just repeat what was done in previous years.

For someone who seems to take a lot of shots at others for their workload, you certainly seem to have a lot of time during the work day to post on eBrandon, Fishin Guy. Are you being paid during the time you spend with these posts ? Is posting on eBrandon one of your responsibilities at work ?  
 
Just as you don't see how teachers are using their time, others don't know your work situation. It is easy to make assumptions and broad generalizations without all the information.

I'm amazed how people think every teacher gets a masters degree, some even act like getting a masters is as easy as making a phone call.  
 
Firstly, a new teacher will have spent $30 to $80 thousand to become a teacher.. then it will take another 2 to 5 years to get a full time job.  
 
Second, very few teachers take the next step to get their masters. It will take most working teachers 3 to 5 years to get a masters degree. Depending on the university, the cost per year will be 3 to 6 thousand. Some courses will involve driving to Wpg one or two nights a week for a 20 weeks.  
 
FYI, it's a job that has a high dropout rate, the average teacher in BSD only has 7 to 8 years experience. Those that have survived the first 10 to 15 years, probably go back to school to surround themselves with people that truly believe in the value of an education.

Fishing guy - you got lit up!!!! Where did you go?

Fishing guy has no idea about anything! I'm so tired of reading posts about teachers, I'm not one, and would never be one! Congrats to those teachers that have the patience to deal with not the kids but the parents of this world!

Sent a post but never made it here. I'm not focused on what teachers do really. I am more worried about the BSD budget. We have a 100 million dollar budget teaching around 8600 students. Don't know about you but that is a boatload of money with no accountability. Let me ask this. Are we getting our best bang for our buck? Does anyone care that the budgets have ballooned 45% over the last 5 years for a 8% increase in students. Everyone is fine that there are over 3200 sub days a month? Curious as to what that costs the division alone. They like to use terms like "Lowest in the province" but fail to say one of highest in Canada. I have no idea about anything? I just repeat what the division says in reports. I have had to spend more than I want to in the schools. We have a weak education system and for those that want to call my bullshit....show me the proof otherwise. I will love to see it. Or will it be the usual "Fishing Guy knows shit" posts. I'm just tired of constantly opening my wallet to additional increases....for what?

i wonder how school divisions in general would handle a situation like what has happened with health care, where government asked for a 15% reduction in administration. It would be nice if all funding for education came from provincial funding. A decree from the education minister should be far more effective than the present system of elected trustees. I am one of those individuals that feel the only way that we will have any control of the education system is when all funding is provided by the provincial government.

One of your own conservative reports  
Fraser institute org  
 
Manitoba has the lowest cost increase per student in Canada 2003 to 2015.  
We show a 36 percent increase, Saskatchewan shows 73 percent.  
 
You talk about facts, and you only show us a link to your own sound off post in the Brandon Sun.  
 
Let's list some of your facts  
Teachers get there "upgraded education" for free.. grants and tax breaks  
Teachers take a couple of courses and return expecting more money  
We have an out of control school board.  
We have the most expensive cost per student in Canada  
We have no accountability in the education system  
Manitoba has the worst credit recovery system  
Manitoba doesn't use enough online courses (like they are an example of quality education)  
Most teachers are just in it for the money  
Most teachers get their Masters just for the increase in pay  
A Masters degree is cheap compared to the bags of money they get for taking a couple of upgrade courses

prairie billy said "i wonder how school divisions in general would handle a situation like what has happened with health care, where government asked for a 15% reduction in administration. It would be nice if all funding for education came from provincial funding. A decree from the education minister should be far more effective than the present system of elected trustees. I am one of those individuals that feel the only way that we will have any control of the education system is when all funding is provided by the provincial government. "

Your suggestion would mean equal money to each division.  
Brandon is a very frugal division, the result of your idea would be a cash cow for BSD.  
 
I might agree with you on this point!  
PS  
You still pay for the education system with taxes.  
You might like this government's ideas, but what happens when the next government promises to spend money to buy votes.  
BSD has a long proven track record of being near the lowest cost per student in Manitoba. Are you willing to bet the provincial political powers will manage education as well as BSD has?  
 
Edited by loeog, 2017-04-04 23:16:45

loeog said "    prairie billy said "i wonder how school divisions in general would handle a situation like what has happened with health care, where government asked for a 15% reduction in administration. It would be nice if all funding for education came from provincial funding. A decree from the education minister should be far more effective than the present system of elected trustees. I am one of those individuals that feel the only way that we will have any control of the education system is when all funding is provided by the provincial government. " Your suggestion would mean equal money to each division.   Brandon is a very frugal division, the result of your idea would be a cash cow for BSD.     I might agree with you on this point!   PS   You still pay for the education system with taxes.   You might like this government's ideas, but what happens when the next government promises to spend money to buy votes.   BSD has a long proven track record of being near the lowest cost per student in Manitoba. Are you willing to bet the provincial political powers will manage education as well as BSD has?     Edited by loeog, 2017-04-04 23:16:45"

Don''t see where "Prairie Billy" says that each division gets equal money! That''s probably not what the province''s minister of education would approve. Funding would more realistically be based on the number of students in a school division, considering transportation and other intangibles that would result in a complex funding formula. BSD may be the best ever as you say. However, most of us feel that spending is out of control and "unchecked" by the province and that''s not good in the long run. For example, some of my neighbour''s in Brandon had their school taxes rise by more than 10% last year. That''s unacceptable! Blame the school boards or assessment, I think both are to blame. Loeog, is there another province in Canada where school taxes are almost equal to residential taxes? I''ve done a quick check with relatives and found that we are highest at almost par between school and residential portions. Other provinces where there are school taxes run about 50% of their residential taxes. That is why this thread was started and homeowners have had enough of the gouging and demand better accountability. We''re not sticking it to the teachers as you perseive. All We''re asking is for accountability. Is that too much to ask?  
 
Edited by 70`s guy, 2017-04-05 00:34:33

It's sort of an interesting word, but at times it causes a great deal of problems when applied regionally.  
Now this may be looked at as being off topic but it is related. In the US, there are states that have implemented minimum wages that are well above the national minimum wage, California and New York State have minimum wages at the 15 dollar level which basically game in a single move.  
The reason I mention this has to do with a economic report that was put out by Time magazine years ago. There were two areas, at that time, that average income was on the low end of the scale, one of those areas was the Sourhwest corner of the province, the other was in Quebec. I don't know if this has changed but hopefully it has, but if the same conditions still exist as far as being on the lower end of the income level, you can see why the idea of equal causes problems.

In other provinces, school divisions get more of their funding from the provincial general revenue, and less through property tax. It's simply a shift of where the money comes from. That is the reason why the people you talk to have lower school property tax. The amount spent per student is usually within plus / minus 10% province to province. We aren't being gouged any more than any other province.

I agree with you asking why such an increase when students only went up 8%. Is this similar to gas prices? Barrel of oil is under $50 similar to what it was years ago yet what has the cost to the consumer gone up by > 100%

I don't think that I would have been bold enought to make such a statement. We as a society need gasoline, and as a society we also need education, so when many people comment that we are being gouged on gasoline prices, does that also mean we are being gouged on education cost.

gekko said "I agree with you asking why such an increase when students only went up 8%. Is this similar to gas prices? Barrel of oil is under $50 similar to what it was years ago yet what has the cost to the consumer gone up by > 100% "

And that is what I am trying to bring to people to ask. Can we control the big oil companies, it is very hard to without government regulation. Jumps in pump pricing should be like I believe the Atlantic provinces have where it is regulated I read somewhere. With the BSD we have 9 people in charge of a 100 million dollar budget that just keeps going up at an alarming rate. I know it wouldn't happen overnight but if a majority of teachers did upgrading to Masters do they automatically get wage increases or does the division have the ability to say they didn't need more master teachers and not pay the higher wages. Any business such as trades only have a handful of Journeymen or less. It is not cost effective to have everyone a top dog per say. People say that teachers don't get paid for the two months of summer. Why can't it be negotiated that over the summer breaks training is done and pay them their wage over the 12 months. Stuff like getting 20 sick days per school year is amazing. There is already 10 months in the school year, minus another month of sick days leaves 9 months of teaching. At what cost is that to the division? It isn't a bash to the teachers so relax.....it is a union negotiated benefit that many take full advantage of. Hence why there are over 3000 sub days a month taken. The shitty thing is unions play unions. This province compares what another province pays, so we need to up the game/wages/benefits to keep our workers. Their were something like 7000 applications for work in the division submitted. There is no shortage of people wanting to get into the division to work. I don't know why we seem to need to be better than other provinces considering our student education is so-so. If long term workers can no longer bring something to the table it is time to change things up, this works for any employment industry. Heck my job isn't for sure, I always have to bring something to the table or I am looking for a new job too. Reading lately that teachers are not to blame. It is what they are told to teach. I would like to know why the teachers are not standing up for/with the students to bring in a better quality of teaching material then. I know a typical union attitude is it isn't the teachers job to say something is broken. Well at my job we are the end users of stuff and if something isn't working we tell the boss it doesn't work and we work together to find better solutions. Is that being done within the division. I mean if someone can show me that that would be wonderful to see everyone progress to better teach our youth. It is always you hear, it's not my job, not my problem, etc. They only ones that suffer are the youth and our wallets. It would be great to have our system improved without having to constantly increase tax dollars at a rate well beyond inflation.

How did you determine that teachers are not standing up for/with the students to bring in a better quality of teaching material?  
 
Also, 20 sick days per year is amazing? I have worked at a few places, some unionized, some not, some public, some private. Most of the places I have worked at aren't amazing, but most have given more than 20 sick days per year.

ultraguy said "How did you determine that teachers are not standing up for/with the students to bring in a better quality of teaching material?     Also, 20 sick days per year is amazing? I have worked at a few places, some unionized, some not, some public, some private. Most of the places I have worked at aren't amazing, but most have given more than 20 sick days per year. "

Most have given more than 20 sick days a year? I have seen vacation days at that. Places I have worked you were lucky to get a sick day. I get 5 per year plus our vacation days. I must be out of touch with benefits at other places. Mine is classified as short term disability and we can't bank them like the school to a max of 130 days. With that many days I would have to hire a lot more bodies each year to fill in being short staffed. That would drive my labour costs through the roof.

Maybe I am in a more competitive industry. But 20 sick days per year seems pretty normal for a university educated professional working at a large company.  
 
Edited by ultraguy, 2017-04-06 15:24:09

Did you know the short term disability insurance that funds teachers until the long term disability kicks in is paid for by teachers and managed by the teachers association.  
Crying about short term disability is like crying about teachers in Brandon getting dental coverage. Teachers pay 100 percent.  
 
Some people really have a hate on for teachers, personally I can't wait for the peace and quite that comes during fishing season!

I wish I worked at a job that allowed me to post during work hours.

Really, 7000 people applied for a teaching job last year at BSD.  
 
Are you just posting this stuff to make more teacher hate.

loeog said "Really, 7000 people applied for a teaching job last year at BSD.     Are you just posting this stuff to make more teacher hate. "

Sorry I have better things to do than make shit up. I am not pulling this out my arse. Maybe go on the division site yourself and READ the publications!  
 
EMPLOYMENT SERVICES:  
For the 2014-2015 school year, Employment Services tracked the following statistics:  
# of job postings within the 2014-2015 school year 384  
# of candidates applying for positions within Brandon School Division 1227  
# of applications processed for consideration of employment 7059  
 
Jesus I am referencing the BUDGET in total. That i:ncludes EA, custodial, EVERYONE! Good grief I even put in my posts it isn't an attack on teachers. Wow. You people get your education here? Here, I will even put the link to the BSD website to reference where I got it so nobody can say I make it up. Good Grief! Page 16 of 98 if you need me to be very specific for you.  
 
https://www.bsd.ca/Division/AboutUs/Documents/Year%20End%20Progress%20Report%20(2014-2015).pdf

So just so everyone is clear.....Fishin_Guy isn't attacking teachers. Fishin_Guy is attacking the BUDGET. Can the BUDGET be brought under control? That includes everything from all staff, operations, the way things are taught, etc.

You just Implied that 7000 people applied for teaching jobs.  
So sorry..  
 
I thank you for pointing out it was 1227 people that applied and that it was for any and every job in the division. If 7000 teachers applied, that would mean 7000 people spent 5 years in university for nothing.

loeog said "I wish I worked at a job that allowed me to post during work hours. "

Me too. That is why I do it during a break. Or when I am not at work. So getting back to the point of the discussion.....got any idea how the BSD can save money?

Good people like yourself should stop coming out of the woodwork after the budget is done.  
 
BSD goes out of its way to get public input in the budget process.  
You have many ideas, take the time to present your issues at one of the many public input opportunities BSD offers!  
 
Just so people don't get the wrong idea.. BSD is one of the cheapest divisions in Manitoba.