Discussions

I'm not a huge fan of unions generally for the reasons you cite, but as I get older I have come to appreciate them.  
 
When I was much younger and working for the government, I got a small mysterious lump sum payment for "employment equity". What used to happen, and *still to this day happens in some workplaces* is women get paid less than men. Same job, same responsibilities and obligations, different pay. The union was the one that drove pay equity for the government. Some women got 60-70k in lost wages.  
 
That workplace was roughly 70% female. There was about 2200 employees there at peak season (and lows about 1000 year round employees). Even though the work force was overwhelmingly female, management was 80+% male. Again, the union pushed for more gender parity in management. It's not that women weren't applying or not qualified, but were not selected for those positions.  
 
So as a women with 3 daughters, I've come to see the good work unions can do. What bothers me particularly is that the current government seem especially bent on quashing dismantling female-dominated professions - teaching and nursing. Take from that what you will.

I don’t know much about women being disadvantaged in the workplace ( undoubtably some are), except that I have worked alongside lots of women and In Three workplaces I have had a female boss. They are as good and capable at any job as a man in my experience.

are sometimes good but not always! Everyone has a different experience.

I think that making assumptions about my general state of positivity/negativity is not particularly helpful in this argument. I am simply being realistic. I haven't seen Brian Pallister care about the average Manitoban in any way, especially over the course of this pandemic.  
 
If it weren't for unions, it would still be legal for children work, it would still be legal for children to work in dangerous conditions, there would be no workplace health and safety, and you could kiss your vacations and paid time off goodbye. There are very very few instances in which having a union is worse than not having a union, in this case you are o:bjectively incorrect.  
 
I said this before and I will say it again. lf you aren't able to see the benefits of unions to average working people, then you are of the very few who exist in a position of privilege over most working people. Not all unions are good unions, but unions as a whole are o:bjectively good.

I base an opinion on what I have seen in history and during my lifetime caused by unions and their overzealous leaders. Destruction of whole industries and massive job loss because the ‘union’ made demand after demand and called multiple long lasting strikes bringing a country to a virtual standstill. Industries and jobs shipped overseas where work conditions are and continue to be far worse. Descimation of whole communities causing huge financial and social problems. A great union success story I think not.  
If unions hadn’t been so greedy and unwilling to compromise, government and employers of the time might have been able to work with them towards a brighter future for everyone.  
 
Edited by Farmergeorge, 2021-07-17 13:26:32

Read up on that. It’s yet another bonehead bill the PCs are trying to implement. What it basically boils down to is getting rid of the rule whereby if a group goes on strike for 60 days, binding arbitration comes into play, thus ending the strike and getting on with things. We enjoy the shortest strikes in Canada and that’s all going to be quashed by these idiots.

They should go further and make strikes illegal

You should live under communist or dictatorship rule it sounds like.

So you feel it’s okay for the Manitoba Nurses Union to work for 4 years without a contract…..through a pandemic? Welcome to the stone ages!

There is nothing wrong with unions. Fighting for fair wages for workers. Protecting workers from shady employers. Without unions you wouldn’t have a 3 day weekend in September. Without unions myself wouldn’t be making a fair wage for the trade I am in, I’d still be at $15 an hour. Farmergeorge hate unions all you want but at the end of the day they are good, and you just didn’t have the life skills or trade to be a part of a union.

I am a fully skilled vehicle technician and auto electrician. I worked for 20 years in various dealerships before becoming self employed and then moving my business to a new country. I have over 30 years experience in the motor trade. I have never needed membership or help from any union. I have the life skills I think thank you.  
Like I said, I have seen the damage and destruction that union rhetoric can cause a community, an industry and a country. I’ve been there and seen it and the lives that were ruined by union action. I listened to self preserving nonsense spewed by a union rep visiting our school encouraging union membership as we entered the work force. I knew people that continued to work during a general strike trying to keep things running as the morgues filled and garbage lined the streets. This can never be allowed to happen again and that is why Unions have no place in a modern , inclusive and democratic society, they are immensely damaging and they must be broken .  
 
Edited by Farmergeorge, 2021-07-18 14:13:48

That is your opinion of unions and you are entitled to it. That does not make you right, nor does everyone agree with you.  
 
I was a unionized worker for almost 40 years. I never saw anything from my union that would make me agree with you. I saw several instances where the union assisted some of my fellow workers. Once that union was a benefit to me. And yes, unions are generally the reason that some jobs pay the money they do, with equal pay for all regardless of gender-the reason workers get 5 and 6 weeks vacation per year, the reason children no longer work in crappy conditions for low pay...  
 
If the best anyone can say about Pallister is that he is trying to break the unions...then sorry, but I suggest you be careful what you wish for.  
 
Palluster's handling of the pandemic-i have doubts that any of the other party leaders would have done any better. I tend to think they might have been worse, but cannot say for sure. All the parties need to come up with better leaders before the next election-there sure is nothing to choose from with the current leaders.

Worst job ever. The joys of union were very few. Thanks to the union reps profit sharing with the owners wages were garbage. My wife brought home more money on maternity leave then my 80 hour pay cheques. All the useless fees, deductions, for what did not benefit me one bit. Unions protect the people who don't deserve jobs you know the type. Those who think they get all the breaks they want, do limited work, take all those sick days cause they are free vacation time. Unions just make everything cost more for the general public who pay their wages and give little guarantee you are getting your money worth. Have you even tried to access government assistance lately and seen how it is getting worse and worse. If they were doing top rated work then worth every penny but when the return is low then no to more.

Wab Kinew is just politically grandstanding by interrupting the news conference of the government minister. If he felt so strongly about the issue then he should have called his own news conference. He is revealing his own personality and it does not look good on him. He accuses others including the premier of dictatorial decisions but he is revealing his own dictatorial behavior. I am not buying into his type of behavior and I believe that the Manitoba public questions his approach to reconciliation. Remember reconciliation is a two way street.

 
 
Edited by KWD, 2021-07-19 19:51:26

Wab Kinew is an honorary witness with the TRC, and one of his responsibilities is to speak out and help other people understand our history. Remaining silent while somebody provides incorrect information would be neglecting his duty as an honorary witness. I think the PC party realizes this, they originally tweeted complaining about the press conference being interrupted, but later deleted the tweet.

What Pallister said was accurate. It’s not politically correct to speak the truth anymore.  
 
The leaders at the time thought that integration/assimilation was the best way to help aboriginal folk succeed in the European type world.  
 
We have known for decades that this system failed in almost every way.

His daughter got married or is getting married this summer so the number of people you can have at outdoor gatherings went up!! LOL perfect timing!!

The fact that he mentioned his mother needed knee surgery and then dumped $50M to reduce surgery wait times is self serving.

This is a very good example of the flawed premise that has allowed this to go on for so long.  
 
Why was it up to the Indigenous people to adapt to a European-type world?  
 
Europeans came to THEIR world. There were already complex and thriving nations living here for countless generations. Why were the people already here forces to assimilate into the new culture? Don't we insist that modern newcomers integrate into OUR society instead of the other way around?  
 
Where there individuals who legitimately thought they were doing good? Probably. But even the most virtuous among them were operating in a system that had the only goal of eliminating the original peoples via assimilation, death, or some combination of the two.  
 
You can't do good in a system that's designed to do evil as it's main feature.