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Need clarification on a rule

Need clarification on a rule

Home Slice
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1360

Home Slice
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1360

Need clarification on a rule
12/9/2020 at 5:43 PM

So some of us seniors are easily confused especially lately when Covid restrictions seem to be changing by the hour. Here’s my scenario: My parents live out of town and they are in their 80’s and 90’s . So am I allowed to go myself to visit them for Xmas for one afternoon or not? Please no need to jump all over me as happens so many times on this forum usually from the same regulars. Just a simple yes or no would be fine so I could let them no one way or another.
UpHere49
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 169

UpHere49
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 169

Sorry, No.
12/9/2020 at 5:56 PM

The rule is no visitors, including family. Health care workers are exempt. Only those living in the home should gather.
Home Slice
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1360

Home Slice
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1360

Rule clarification
12/9/2020 at 6:09 PM

Ok. Thank you.
Cheezies
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1623

Cheezies
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1623

No
12/9/2020 at 6:21 PM

If you had one parent that lived alone, they can have one visitor but since you said parents, then no. Anyone that lives alone is allowed to have one visitor in their home. But it has to always be the same person. Meaning they can’t have multiple people coming by one at a time. It’s the same person everytime.
And there are exceptions for healthcare workers, child caregivers, workers such as hydro etc.
But if your parents live together, than no, no visiting.
Adam

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 15663

Adam
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 15663

Rules
12/9/2020 at 6:25 PM

UpHere49 said "The rule is no visitors, including family. Health care workers are exempt. Only those living in the home should gather. "
Close. Must be same household, except if a person that lives alone. If they live alone they can designate one person who can visit them alone (just the one visitor). They can reciprocate and visit that person who visited them. Per Roussin at today’s media briefing:
https://youtu.be/_-XW3FuGe30

I’m hoping they’ll consider a slight tweak and do as BC in allowing a living alone person to join the bubble of one household but that isn’t the rule as written in Manitoba and we need to live within the rules as written as part of the overall response in this province.
vegimite
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 686

vegimite
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 686

According
12/9/2020 at 7:39 PM

to the regulations the following applies.
ORDER 1
(1) Subject to subsections (2) and (3), a person who resides in a private residence must not permit a person who does not normally reside in that residence to enter or remain in the residence.
1(2) Subsection (1) does not prevent a person from entering the private residence of another person for any of the following purposes:
(a) to provide health care, personal care or housekeeping services;

(b) for a visit between a child and a parent or guardian who does not normally reside with that child;

This to me says that a child can visit a parent where they do not normally live in the same home.
However in light of the possibility of virus transmission, I would suggest that it would be better to stay away until all this is over or restrictions are lessened.
We will not be having our children visit this Christmas.
Giddyup
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 473

Giddyup
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 473

vegemite
12/9/2020 at 8:01 PM

“child” is meaning a minor child.... You can have the other parent of a common child in your house for the purposes of visitation with that child. Adult children are not allowed to visit a parent unless they both live alone and are the other ones chosen visitor.
vegimite
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 686

vegimite
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 686

A child
12/9/2020 at 8:08 PM

is not anything but a parents offspring.
The regulations do not, as far as I'm aware define a child as being under a certain age.
Abbysmum
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5038

Abbysmum
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5038

child
12/9/2020 at 10:50 PM

vegimite said "is not anything but a parents offspring.
The regulations do not, as far as I'm aware define a child as being under a certain age. "
I think in this context, they mean minor child.

Adult children do not typically have guardians, which is specified.
RainaRo
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 724

RainaRo
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 724

outside
12/9/2020 at 11:03 PM

I think many of us will end up having an outdoor Christmas since that’s going to be allowed at least up to 5 people
Howdy
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 11

Howdy
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 11

Child
12/9/2020 at 11:05 PM

What if adult child is living with parents, can they have their boyfriend/girlfriend over to the house
Gussins
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 380

Gussins
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 380

I would think
12/9/2020 at 11:58 PM

you can visit your parents on Christmas (or any day) as they are quite elderly and this would fall under care giving and/or well-being check. Adam's post provides a good link for info. Personally, I would wear a mask and attempt to social distance as much as possible for their (and your) safety as well as keep the visit on the shorter end.

Edited by Gussins, 2020-12-10 00:05:43
Gussins
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 380

Gussins
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 380

.
12/10/2020 at 12:00 AM

Knowitall said "What if adult child is living with parents, can they have their boyfriend/girlfriend over to the house "
No.
Cjford
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 419

Cjford
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 419

Not allowed
12/10/2020 at 2:47 AM

RainaRo said "I think many of us will end up having an outdoor Christmas since that’s going to be allowed at least up to 5 people "
At any persons residence indoors or outdoors. Only seems allowed in public outdoor spaces which is b.s. spacing is spacing.

https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/mobile/can-manitobans-have-outdoor-gatherings-at-their-homes-1.5223288
JM3030
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 227

JM3030
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 227

I agree
12/10/2020 at 8:47 AM

Cjford said "At any persons residence indoors or outdoors. Only seems allowed in public outdoor spaces which is b.s. spacing is spacing.

https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/mobile/can-manitobans-have-outdoor-gatherings-at-their-homes-1.5223288 "
This doesn't make any sense to me. And its actually really hard for us to follow. We rent in a house split into 3 suites... are we allowed to be in the yard at the same time? Technically each suite is its own household/ residence. But there's only one yard that doesn't belong to one specific residence.
Johnbisonbear
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 4183

Johnbisonbear
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 4183

To the OP
12/10/2020 at 9:23 AM

You have to do what you are comfortable with.
If my parents were still here I would want to see them at Christmas especially when they are at a certain age.
Have you over the course of covid been to visit your parents for care giving? Making them a meal for Christmas Day should be considered care giving.
bluuu
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 9

bluuu
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 9

Democratic Country
12/10/2020 at 9:32 AM

This is one Law I never expected to see or even to be possible in any democratic country of the west.
GetRec'd
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 234

GetRec'd
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 234

...
12/10/2020 at 10:01 AM

TC, please follow the public health regulations. Hopefully, with the recent news of vaccine's being shipped, you will be able to have a nice meaningful visit with your parents, give them big hugs and everything, before the winter's over.

We get there if we all work together. Don't try to justify your holiday visit as care-giving or anything else. I'm sure the last thing your parents would want for you is a big fat COVID fine to pay, or for any of you to get sick.

GL and happy holidays!
cotr
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 631

cotr
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 631

.
12/10/2020 at 10:58 AM

So here’s my situation.
My mother is 80. Lives out of town by herself. My father recently passed away.
I think I will fight the ticket so that just my wife and I will go and have Christmas Dinner with her.
Spades!!
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1224

Spades!!
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1224

Cotr
12/10/2020 at 11:03 AM

Your Mom lives alone. She is entitled to a visit by a designated family member or support. That is what public health rules state. Not sure that i:ncludes both you and your spouse though. But I hear what you are saying. It is a difficult time of year to be alone.
Gammy
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 42

Gammy
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 42

Rule confusion
12/10/2020 at 11:24 AM

I am also a senior who lives alone. I (a retired teacher) am allowed to go to my daughter’s home to assist with home schooling. I am also allowed to provide child care when she and her spouse are working at the same time. My daughter is my 1 person. Yesterday, because of this confusion, I called the city police for clarification. The person I spoke to said that because I live alone, I am allowed to go to her home for Christmas without fear of repercussions. I did make sure when asking, that she understood that my daughter’s home includes her husband and children.
Howdy
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 11

Howdy
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 11

Neighbours
12/10/2020 at 11:33 AM

So if you see neighbours kids have their boyfriend/girlfriend coming and going from their house should you be that neighbour that rats them out. I know I want to but at the same time I don’t want to be that person and hope that them doing the wrong thing will catch up to them. It’s just frustrating when some of us are doing everything that is being asked of us and others are doing what they want and trying to be sneaky about it. Rules have been put in temporary so why can’t people just follow them. It’s going to take all of us to fight and control this virus from spreading.
Giddyup
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 473

Giddyup
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 473

Knowitall
12/10/2020 at 12:17 PM

Just going to be the devils advocate here... maybe that person you see coming and going is providing child care or tutoring or other “allowable” exceptions?? House cleaners are still allowed to go into peoples homes. Maybe she’s cleaning. Or maybe she’s a massage therapist... that’s still allowed. Don’t get me wrong, I’m a rule follower and have been abiding by the rules, but I think outright banning anyone in your home is ridiculous. My neighbour is having work done to their house and has had umpteen various trades people coming and going for weeks, but I can’t have my adult child come for Xmas supper because he has a roommate??? Nope, sorry doesn’t make sense to me.
Howdy
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 11

Howdy
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 11

Giddyup
12/10/2020 at 12:45 PM

Like I said before”adult children living at home” would boyfriend/girlfriend be allowed to visit household. I already know it’s not a tutor or someone coming to clean their house.
JayeMac
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 3

JayeMac
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 3

All single
12/10/2020 at 12:46 PM

I am a senior living alone as do both my son and daughter. Can they come to my house for Christmas? My home is totally isolated.
Adam

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 15663

Adam
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 15663

Visiting
12/10/2020 at 1:10 PM

JayeMac said "I am a senior living alone as do both my son and daughter. Can they come to my house for Christmas? My home is totally isolated. "
The Brandon Sun posted a thorough answer to their question from yesterday's media briefing.
See the link for the whole answer, but these words are right from Dr. Roussin answer what you're looking for:

"if a person lives alone, they can designate one person to come spend time with them. Not two, but one. But it’s also the reciprocal of that, they can then visit that person in their household, as well."
Link:
https://www.brandonsun.com/local/readers-ask-christmas-pmh-positivity-rate-573353101.html
Rural
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 51

Rural
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 51

Yes you can
12/10/2020 at 6:42 PM

I am sure that while you are there you are going to provide some help with cleaning, yard work, maybe take them groceries as your parents quite elderly. If you/they can pay someone to come and do these essential services for seniors then yes family members can go do it too.
Home Slice
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1360

Home Slice
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1360

Maybe it should have included both parents?
12/10/2020 at 6:44 PM

Well the response to a simple question turned out to be a lot of posts which is good. However after reading all the posts it has left me with another question. So if I only would’ve had one parent that was alive I could’ve gone to see either mom or dad but because both are living I can’t go at all. Wouldn’t it have been easier if they had made the rule to 3 per household? That way each sibling could have had a separate day with their parents. I’m sure the three of us would have no problem wearing the masks indoors or out if we could at least visit?
curlysister
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 2980

curlysister
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 2980

No
12/10/2020 at 6:56 PM

Skinnymoon, if someone lives alone (ie- if you had one parent alive), only ONE person is to be designated to go. So no, each sibling could NOT have a separate day with the parents.
Adam

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 15663

Adam
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 15663

Covid and the holidays
12/10/2020 at 9:52 PM

I know that a lot of people are reaching a point of exhaustion with this virus, the temporary changes that have come with it and the sacrifices that are going to have to be made over the holidays to keep this community safe.... but it would be a massive mistake to overlook just how ideal of an environment for spread the Christmas+New Years season is. If you thought August-long triggered an outbreak in this community, you ain’t seen nothing yet if that gathering moves indoors.

Some might have different preferences or suggestions for how things could be done and I’d encourage them to let their representation know those suggestions for consideration as I’ve done just in case there’s an angle that hasn’t been considered. At the end of the day though none of us are epidemiologists or (as far as I know) doctors and there needs to be a level of trust, understanding and respect that the full picture is being taken into account and that rules and regulations in place over the holidays are to prevent what could truly be a disaster for any community whose residents disregard how perfect of a setup the holiday season is for this virus.

From today's media briefing Q & A, I know it isn't necessarily folks' first choice but it was made clear that something like a walk in a public park with a group size of up to five is fair game (with the usual fundamentals followed). You never quite know what you're going to get weather-wise on the 25th... but for what its worth out of the last ten December 25ths, half (five) of them had single-digit high temps. If not, this of all years will be the one to get re-acquainted with the idea that Manitoba weather so often comes down to how you dress for it!
If you haven't gotten on the Zoom/Skype/FaceTime bandwagon and are feeling a little intimidated by it, don't be shy to start a thread. So many helpful members on this site that I guarantee you'll find a lot of folks willing to help you in the right direction.
If you haven’t had a chance to, check out the discussion on Alternative Christmas ideas which has had quite the run of different suggestions lately:
https://ebrandon.ca/messagethread.aspx?message_id=1064003&cat_id=315

This will also be a great time to make use of options being provided by local restaurants, be it spoiling yourself, surprising someone else with a delivery (or both!). A new thread started today goes into some of the options:
https://ebrandon.ca/messagethread.aspx?message_id=1064942&cat_id=315

This Christmas will be different but it doesn’t mean we can’t create memories that will last. Just in what I do for a living I’ve had to naturally adopt a sort of forward-thinking side... and that side of me is pretty sure that however our family makes it work this year under these circumstances it will be the creative, thoughtful, unique touches that stand out in the memory as much as anything I’ll live through.