Discussions

I totally agree.

Speaking as someone who is self employed $12.50 hour looks pretty good to me right now. The economy is in the tank and looks to be staying there for the foreseeable future.. We have to adjust our expectations.

I like these topics. I find it interesting why those that complain about wages don't do something about it. Gagalady I would love to see your cleaning business open shop and support locally hired people at wages that you expect. How many years education do you need to become a professional detailer? With a shop, vehicles, payroll, chemicals, rags, etc. How much do you figure you could get per hour and still pay a living wage. What is your number then as a living wage start?

I do work as a Custodian and worked in the beginning of this Pandemic, during this Pandemic and right now with the unpredictable future with this Pandemic as a Custodian. So my words come from experience and trying to make a living to provide for myself. What do you actually do Fishin Guy??? I see you on ebrandon an aweful lot and tend to have comments on everything. Put your money where your mouth is and share what do you do to make a living??? Are you a front line of anything in this Pandemic??? Just curious??? Also, curious what you think a fair wage is???? Thank you

And, this is why people would rather stay on Cerb or EI . They get more money on these then they would working a minimum wage job!

The wages in this town are just gross.  
With Covid, cleaning jobs should be bumped up to at least $15 to $20 bucks an hour. They are essential workers and are on the front line. Its not an easy job either, heavy manual labor.

Thing that bugs me about a lot of the job postings on here are the jobs that are advertised as "part time". They then say that you have to be "available evenings and weekends", but they don't specify what shifts/days you will actually work. So, evenings and weekends in addition to days, if so, which days? Are you expected to be basically "on call" at any time the business is open? If so, then it's not truly part time and they should say so. Most people who are looking for part time are trying to find a job that will fit their life. Maybe they are a student who can only work evenings. Maybe they are looking for a second job and need to have specific shifts. Maybe they are close to retirement age and can't work full time or don't need full time, but would prefer to know which days/shifts they will be working, possibly because they need to schedule their life around medical appointments, etc .  
 
Edited by Triplethreat, 2020-08-26 14:58:34

You basically said that some able people choose to not work and receive benefit even though work is available to them. The market place should decide remuneration not the government.

I don't blame the people at home on cerb. Ive had it 4 times in the past month where I've gone in for interviews for a "full time" position just to get a call offering temporary part time. It is incredibly difficult to schedule part time jobs around each other to get enough hours to get by, but thats what a lot of positions in town are right now even when they're advertised differently. Cerb is the equivalent of full time minimum wage, its not an extraordinary amount of money. The market is part of the problem.

I am not on eBrandon very much. To me it is losing its sparkle.  
https://www.publicsafety.gc.ca/cnt/ntnl-scrt/crtcl-nfrstrctr/esf-sfe-en.aspx  
According to the government my job and my better half are both Essential Services. Do we get government help, nope, special "pandemic" money, nope. I manage a manufacturing facility. Does that make you feel any better? Took me half my life to get where I am, education and training. Between my wife and I we are potentially exposed to a lot of scenarios everyone else is exposed to. There is no danger pay, nobody to pat us on the back saying thank you. Do I care, nope. As for fair wage. I asked you that question first. Where is your answer? A fair wage is what the market can sustain in your line of work. Plain and simple. It has nothing to do with your expenses. If I bought a house and paid it off while you just bought a house and have that extra mortgage payment and we work at the same place should you get more because it costs you more to live? I hear living wage all the time. "I wish my wife didn't have to work and stay home with our 4 kids" while I make a living wage. Why doesn't anyone pay that much?" Hear that all the time. People complain about renting a 3 bedroom house for $1200 a month for a family of 4. Really that is $300 per person. Isn't that affordable living? Who makes the definition of affordable?

I'm with fishin guy, the market will pay what the market will sustain. Will a cleaning company receive any work if they pay employees significantly more? Unlikely cleaning is a price sensitive service that requires little of the employees other then background checks to qualify. There is also many one man band cleaning operations to compete with that have little to no overhead.  
 
Bottom line is if the line of work your in doesn't pay what you want do something about it and enter a new line of work. Move for a better opportunity do what you have to do, money doesn't fall on your lap because you think you deserve it.

I am not entirely sure what your main complaint is. Is it that minimum wage is not higher or that custodial services tend to be paid closer to minimum wage? If it is the latter, what positions do you think should be paid at minimum wage? You intimate that minimum wage might be fine for a teenager but not an older person with family responsibility. Are you suggesting that a wage should be paid based on the age and circumstances of a person as opposed to the job and their performance at that job?  
 
I have owned businesses so have a very clear view of what folks are willing to pay for what kind of work.  
 
You also state that you are being asked to go into volatile and highly vulnerable situations. Could you elaborate on that?  
 
Hopefully my questions are not seen as rude or dismissive.I have certainly not had your experiences so can only try to gain further understanding by asking questions based on my experiences.  
 
Edited by JustASoul, 2020-08-26 21:26:41

People, or I guess society in general, has really lost touch with just how much it actually costs to do things/buy things/receive a service.  
 
People want to pay the bare minimum to receive a quality service/product, but it doesn't work that way. No matter the job people should be paid a livable wage period. If people knew the true cost of the products they buy, they'd be buying a lot less.

if you are complaining about the people on cerb try living on less than half of that and have medical conditions to boot.  
 
I have been trying to find a job because I cannot live on what I receive. Where everyone is buying new TV's , getting new cars and all that with their Cerb I can barley fill my cupboard. I know about the food bank but for a single person with no kids, you get basically nothing. And besides I have to eat a particular diet because of my health conditions.  
 
When one of my nurses heard I was looking for a job she asked "why?" I told her that I can barley afford to live as it is and next year most likely I will need a new place to live and I cannot afford a new place.  
 
And even with my long work history I still cannot get a job today.

As long as there are people willing to work for the legal minimum wage as cleaners, that's the wage.

if you don't like the pay, find another job. It may mean getting up in the morning and taking some training or working in a low paying job to get experience. A lot of jobs pay according to what the employer can afford to pay after the bills are paid and what he can afford to pay based on what he can charge. It may look like he is rakin in the cash but In many cases he has put his house up for security to start the business, and needs to safe gard his investment.  
Ultimately it is up to you to find a way to produce the income that you need to support the lifestyle you feel entitled to.  
The employer does not owe you anymore than he promises. You don't like what he promises, move on.  
As for part time job advertisements, take some ambition and ask some questions. Many advertisements are wrote to see who has the guts and initiative to respond and ask some questions. It is part of the interview process that starts before you apply. Some, not all of the part time jobs are somewhat fluid and adaptable to the benefit of the employee and employer.  
 
Again It is your life, apply, apply, be prepared to move for the right job, it is up to YOU nobody else on how your life works out.  
Things that can help is, if there is free training, take it even if you think it is not relevant. Looking for the right job is a full time job, not 2 hours of looking and 6 hours of complaining. Do not use a standard resume, fine tune it for the job you are applying for. BS does not usually work for very long.  
 
Edited by floyd2, 2020-08-27 19:53:03

I am an essential worker and went to college for 2 years, have been working at my current job for a decade and I don’t make $20 bucks an hour. Based on all that I do, I should be making way more but the government doesn’t think so.  
 
Cleaning is hard work I’ve done it before but $20 an hour is a bit much.

I know that there are people out there in Brandon & surrounding area that are independent cleaners that charge & receive $20/hour for in home house cleaning, and that is just for light housekeeping.  
 
The market is there for them, they just have to know how to market themselves and keep on it. Their reputation depends on how well they do their work and so then does their job security as well. They want it & make it work.  
 
Edited by Flutterby, 2020-08-27 22:22:49

part time or full time is NOT in reference to the shift you work but the hours per week you will work. part time is 31 hours or less, full time is 32 hours and up. If a person is looking to fill in or go with another job then a conversation with the employer and perspective employer would take place and then they try to accommodate your availability.

It's a fine line that has this subject sway either way on how the interpretation can be viewed for each individual circumstance. Take my daughters for example... About to have her second year in University, worked three years part time, slinging groceries all through the pandemic. She hasn't had "hero pay" for two months, her schedule consists of generally twenty hours a week and last minute call-in to cover other peoples shifts. Dried out hands, cranky customers, itchy masks and co-workers who just don't care if they work or not. She hates her job, but sticks with it. Meanwhile, many of her friends are taking home more money through CERB and other programs during this last half year. They got to play all summer while she worked her miserable job. ...And believe me, she wanted to live the life like her friends. Unfortunately, her circumstances with her income amount prior to COVID and hours she worked made her slip right "through the cracks" to benefit from anything. She was pi$$ed with the system five months ago and still is today. The few friends that did work got great paying "student jobs" that she never knew were made available, due to the impression given & assumption of the pandemic and that most openings were last minute and through "word of mouth". "Perfect!" she says to me, sarcastically "The guy who can't maintain a 70% is doing research and padding his resume, while I have to close the store every Friday night, waiting for slowpokes to finish shopping before I wipe down everything." So, the question to everyone... Is she acting entitled or is she just simply frustrated for being a product of our times? People can take it either way. Some will feel insulted that she's expecting better and deserves more during these challenging times, while others will see the different point of view that she and others like her shouldn't be "on the bottom". Unfortunately, someone has to be on the bottom and because the way life is, it's my daughters place right now. Today, I feel her attitude and focus needs an adjustment. She just has to not dwell, keep working hard and wait for the opportunities to present themselves. That's life. ... Do your best, don't give up, take chances, except the outcomes that can't be changed and don't take any of it for granted.  
 
Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

I was reminded of a part time job that I had a long time ago. When I got the job, they told me that I would work Wednesday to Saturday and that I would have Sunday through Tuesday off. I was fine with that and so were they, or so it seemed. One Wednesday, after I had been there 3 or 4 months, I came in to work and was asked "Where were you on Sunday? We were trying to get a hold of you, we needed you to come in". I told them the truth, that I had gone to Winnipeg. It was, after all my day off. "You can't do that. You have to be available" was their response. I told them that they had never told me that when I was hired, which they hadn't. I stayed there for a few more months, but that was the point when things started to sour. This was before everybody had a cell phone.

Someone who is running a business charging $20/hour isn't the same as an employee cleaner earning less.  
 
As a self-employed person, that independent cleaner will be responsible for any costs (and risks) for running that business. They often pay for their own cleaning supplies, transportation to multiple worksites, accounting, and may do their own payroll deductions, such as paying both portions into EI (vs. an employee who only pays one portion).  
 
Plus, they might need to advertise, have insurance, and other expenses I can't even begin to guess at.  
 
Compare that to an employee cleaner who just has to show up at work. Their materials are all provided, they assume no financial risk, their employer has insurance and their employer also pays the employer portion of the payroll deductions.  
 
When you start to add it all up, that independent person probably doesn't earn a whole lot more than the OP. The difference is that they can pick and choose their work, and take less risky assignments.  
 
Should cleaners be paid more? Absolutely. So should child care workers, meat processing workers, and lots of other occupations. Farmers should also get more for their crops, lots are barely breaking even (most farmers I know also have off-farm jobs to make ends meet). But unless we're willing to pay the true cost of those products and services, it's not going to happen.

Just had to interject, I was being paid over $17 an hour and I didn't clear $1000 every 2 weeks.

Just think it is necessary to point out that the entry level wage for a licensed practical nurse who could/would be working directly with covid suspect and covid positive individuals in our province is $27.30/hr. There are few opportunities in Brandon to be hired into a full time permanent position in this role, even after gaining practice hours and experience so many newer LPNs hold part time jobs, some of which are only term positions covering vacancies for maternity leave, illness, etc.. This job requires a 2 year college diploma, a demanding shiftwork schedule and annual licensing fees to practice. Not to mention the responsibility of others lives and well being. Nurses in Manitoba have had a wage freeze for the last 4 years and most did not qualify for the one time risk payment put forth by the government for those working in essential roles during the pandemic.  
I agree that there are many individuals working on the front lines of this pandemic and that that poses challenges and risks no one could have imagined prior to this year, but I also think it is important to recognize that wages are often reflective of education and training. In the case of our health care providers that we are all relying so heavily on right now to help get us through the covid crisis that reflection can be quite a poor one.

considering there are some ill be it rare in brandon jobs that pay $15 and hour to start to do night shifts at hotel upwards of $18. So no i dont believe that cleaning homes or public places, schools etc should get paid less then that for what can be gross work sometimes.  
 
i do agree that certain jobs the govt regulates should be reevaluated for raises.

CERB will not generally clear $1000 every two weeks either when all is said and done. The tax man awaits for the end of the fiscal year. Your first 12 to 15K of income for the year is tax free, but after that they are going to want their third.

I am a cleaner for two jobs. The one job I work at a government building... And you would think they would pay us a good wage... Nope. I get like $12.50 an hour for that job and the B%$&@ who runs the building is complete well B%$&@. Always complaining about my cleaning. And then my second cleaning job..I get $13.50 an hour... With no complaints. Other people think us cleaners don't deserve a better wage... When if it weren't for us.. you all would have to clean up your messes. Cleaning should be at least $15 an hour...

It's $9999 that is tax free... After that they tax you

Maybe you should do that job and see how it really is. Your attitude would change pretty darn fast.  
 
Edited by 14K, 2020-08-30 09:52:14