Discussions

And it starts. Cmon people let’s not start this panic mentality again. The world is not coming to an end. There is no need to stockpile grocery items, paper products, cleaning products, hand sanitizers, water and especially not milk. Shop as you would have shopped prior to this announcement. Just because they announced on Monday that we are now in Code Red doesn’t mean the grocery stores won’t be open. They will be open and will remain open through this critical red stage. Hopefully the stores are limiting the items that are being excessively purchased.

I am trying to keep to the same thing I did before.  
Buy a month's worth of groceries if possible to limit exposure as I have a very low immune system.

common sense and courtesy would be appreciated. We are right back to the way we were in the spring except the temperatures are colder now. Single person shopping is in place again as shoppers allowed in stores is down to 25% capacity. That means if you go in as a couple someone has to stand and wait for you outside so please check your insecurities and allow yourselves to be separated for ten minutes. I see this everywhere.  
 
One thing that I guarantee will make me explode into Karen mode is if I approach a lineup outside a store in the cold and see a senior citizen freezing while young people are in front of them and people are reading every word of every label they can (we should only be touching what we plan to buy anyway). Call me old school but I believe we should take care of our most vulnerable at this time and a little sacrifice goes a long way in easing someone else's discomfort. A little common sense and courtesy....someday you'll be that age.

that produce is a gray area, but most people don't need to touch 50 apples to pick one. In fact, there aren't that many articles of produce that can't be determined visually. Produce is something that should be washed prior to consuming anyway. I was referring more to canned goods, dressing, cereals, etc., while people are waiting in the cold.

What an unbelievable failure by the Pallister government. It's almost unthinkable at this stage in the pandemic.  
 
More half measures, vague directives, and a complete lack of leadership. I can not wait to vote this guy out of office.  
 
We are code red, and they've done nothing to protect students (or the families of students), they've already caved to pressure on restricting contact, and have done nothing to curb non-essential travel.  
 
I'm tired of people getting sick and having a provincial government more concerned with the pocket book (and their conservative credentials) than saving people's lives.  
 
Thank heavens enough Canadians made the decision to re-elect Trudeau, with Scheer in office, there's no doubt we'd be USA 2.0. Unfortunately, we have a little slice of it here in Manitoba under Pallister.  
 
Maybe next election, we elect someone that gives half a damn about Manitobans?

Can people please stop bitching all the time. I’m so sick of it. Now watch the comments to this post. lol

Amazing how much we need to blame a government for our own actions. Sure get rid of one government and when they are not good enough, blame them and vote in another. Seems everyone can do a much better job at running the province. So GetRec'd what would you have done in power? Money is not unlimited. The Federal government is paying all these people to sit at home, how is that working? Companies are closing. Businesses cannot pay bills with hopes and dreams. I spoke with some Covid cases in Brandon. out of 7 positive cases only one had the shits. Yes it hits older people harder it seems but we are shutting down a whole economy for what? How do you keep your head above water when so heavily weighted in debt? Why doesn't Trudeau just give every business money to cover their operating costs for 6 months, along with every single working person in Canada cover their wage for 6 months and have every single person stay home. Only way for food and essentials is delivery via military in hazmat suites sanitized after every delivery. I mean it would cost probably trillions of dollars but hey all in the name of Covid. Hate to say but people like my daughter who is playing the system is making good Covid money each month and not working, thinks it is a joke and does gatherings with her other failed members of society. So what should we do about them too? Christ stop blaming the government for not holding your hand. Put some big person pants on and take responsibility for one's own self and protect yourself.

Are our memories so short that we have to go through all this again.  
On the first go round of this virus it was explained the survival times of the virus on certain surfaces, those numbers likely remain the same. Fruits and vegetables can be left to soak or rinsed in a mild bleach solution, then rinsed off.  
One can accept that there may be disruption in supply chains, but panic buying just makes those situations worse.

Don Brown, agree big time with you, but I wonder if a lot of people weren't just stocking up for the 4 weeks or so of (sort of) increased restrictions.  
 
I'll likely do my grocery orders on-line for the next month or so, so I could understand those that don't shop this way to purchase for a month rather than a week or two, like they may normally do.  
 
Definitely best to keep a level head though, as you mentioned.  
 
As for FishinGuy, I'm sorry to hear about your daughter. What a post.

I agree with what Fishing Guy said about stop blaming the government. I see the comments on CBC Manitoba when the Manitoba Covid segments are aired. Lots of people blaming Pallister or Roussin for the problems right now. Well they are only one person each and cannot control what everyone does. We are in this situation because people have not been following the fundamentals.  
So if I can offer a different mindset to all those people who are upset over the restrictions.  
1. It is temporary. If all of us stay safe, one person shopping per household, stay home when sick even mild symptoms, wear a mask when out and wash or sanitize hands and try to avoid touching your face we can bring down the numbers again.  
2. Thinking about being stuck at home. Instead think you are safe at home. Home is where you can get away from the dangers of Covid. It is your haven, your home base.  
3. Fear is the basis for most crazy actions. But only you can manage your fear. No one else can do this. We are are all afraid of Covid and what it can potentially do to us, our family and friends. Be aware of your fear, validate it but don’t let it control you. You stay safe when you focus your energy on following fundamentals.  
4. These are tough times and our mental health can be struggling. Seek out help.

I agree completely about the panic buying. On Monday, I went to my local box store grocery store to buy a head of lettuce and a few other items. In and out in around ten minutes. The lineups hadn’t begun yet but the shelves already resembled communist Russia. As an earlier poster said, we don’t need to stockpile. All the stockpiling does is limit the selection for those behind you and they in turn will buy more because they’re afraid it wont be there next time. The issue will just build on itself and we will face shortages again like we saw in the spring, not because there is a lack of resources but because there is an over abundance of morons. How many people who panic bought toilet paper in the spring still have rolls of it left from then? I bet more than a few!!!  
And YES let the elderly or frail in line ahead of you. Our society is slowly turning into a dont give a crap one.  
That’s my rant, let the hate mail begin! LOL

So, a couple thoughts...  
 
1. Don't always dismiss couples shopping together as something bad. Early in the pandemic, my parents shopped together but they were in fact shopping for three households simultaneously... themselves, my grandmother, and my brother's family. So they actually reduced the number of people in the store. We don't know people's intentions or circumstance.  
 
2. I admit I was one of those people who went out Tuesday as soon as they made the announcement and stocked up on a few things. Not crazy, but remembering last time it was weeks you had to wait for a grocery order. I wanted to make sure I had enough perishables and a few essentials I needed on hand to last a couple of weeks in case we were in that position again.  
 
So far, so good. I was just looking at Superstore and you can get orders with about a 2-day lead time so far, so not too far out of normal.

Fishing guy - Well said and sorry about your daughters expectations.  
 
As someone who only shops once every 2 - 3 weeks I "small stock pile" even before the pandemic to get through the 3 weeks, the only difference I have noticed with the pandemic is the line ups . Plus side as someone who does not like people being close to me the social distancing has been great.  
 
Back when this first started the Canadian government chief medical officer Dr Tam said it wouldn't affect us. Then she said non medical masks weren't required and wouldn't help. Then they were to be used. Now she wants 3 layer masks. How is our provincial government supposed to make decisions when the federal government keeps changing their rules. Everyone whining on the news they should have been better prepared. Science doesn't know about this virus and they keep changing the facts. The provincial officials and police can only control the stupidity of people so much like having large gatherings and not wearing masks. Maybe those that are caught in stead of being fined put them in the care homes to give the caregivers a break.  
 
With Trudeau's excessive hand outs the future tax payer is in trouble. Having a small home based business my business has come to a complete shut down since March. I am not entitled to any of Trudeau's hand outs because I also farm but it was my business that bought the small essentials. Wait for the backlash when all these people who got Trudeaus's CERB payments when they have to pay tax on it as it is taxable income.  
 
Mayor Crest had a very sensible interview on the news. With the Prairie Mountain area it was brought under control and if we all cooperate and follow the rules it can be brought under control again. Too bad Winnipeg Mayor Bowman wouldn't take a lesson from Mayor Crest and quit whining and asking for handouts.  
 
Edited by oldcowgirl, 2020-11-12 13:33:06

Science is never static and we have to be flexible to change along with new scientific findings. This is how science works. We do not have all the answers so we have to rely on research as it comes out.

I agree that Science is changing but why is the media and posters on this sight saying it Pallisters government fault that they should have been prepared. They don't know with this virus and are doing the best with what the science they are given.

When something new comes out, do you automatically know everything about it? Of course not. Covid is the same. And, with the vast variety of symptoms, it is not an easy virus to learn about. They made the best recommendations they could based on what they had learned. As they learn more, they have found some of their previous recommendations were wrong. Luckily, they are not so proud that they can not admit an error (won't say mistake, as again, it was based on limited data), and are willing to correct it with the updated information. Going forward, we may find that some of what we are doing now, we will no longer be doing in the future. As they learn more about it. How learning works.  
 
You are correct though, we can get this under control. We did it before. Just hope Winnipeg can too.

They are meant to provide guidance and leadership, and have failed incredibly on both counts. They are weak, and have been from the jump.  
 
It's literally their job, and relying on every individual to use their "common sense" has been a failed measure every where it's been implemented. Why? Because common sense differs from person to person, and allows leniency to the COVID-truther community, which in turn ends up in more infections (and sadly, deaths).  
 
Look across the country, and there is a clear correlation between leaders that are willing to put public health above politics, and lower infection numbers. There is NO excuse for Manitoba to be impacted so drastically. With better leadership, we could be in Saskatchewan's situation, rather than where we are.  
 
I don't know why so many are willing to defend poor Pallister. He chose to lead a Province he has little interest in, and now it's time to hold him accountable.  
 
And anyone commenting on the tax issue is so far out of their depth, it isn't even funny. Even if it were an issue (which it's not), I'd rather a tax burden down the road than an increasing death toll.

I don't know if you want to hold SK up as an example. They're also surging, only a couple weeks behind us. https://saskatoon.ctvnews.ca/we-are-losing-the-battle-as-covid-19-numbers-surge-over-300-sask-doctors-sign-letter-calling-for-more-action-1.5183937  
 
The only place in Canada doing well is the Atlantic bubble and the North.

I agree, I was there a few weeks back and the amount of people wearing masks was very few and far between. Even placed that had stated face masks required had maybe half of which wearing them and no one trying to enforce it.

Have mostly been brought to this point by people’s lack of self discipline and their inability or refusal to do as they are asked during a declared public health emergency. Now we have no choice and government is taking the necessary control to hopefully prevent things getting worse  
It’s time to do knuckle down and do the best that we can under these restrictions and quit whinging!  
 
Edited by Farmergeorge, 2020-11-12 14:52:55

post would be legitimate if, like it or not, Pallister were not at fault. But he is, so say Ottawa, so say leading scientific experts, so say the opposition (the NDP is earning my vote more and more each day) and so say the numbers.  
 
From the beginning Pallister made it very clear that he was not going to work with Ottawa, his main priority was keeping the economy open and he was going to take a back seat to Roussin. You seem to be of the same mindset as him, but it matters not about CERB. That is a federal issue not provincial. We live in a selfish society and therefore cannot sit back and hope that people do the right thing. There is only one person in this province with the authority to make people do the right thing and he failed.  
 
You see, Pallisters refusal to act sooner, the layoffs of vital health care workers in the spring, the closure of ICU beds, the refusal to listen to the repeated requests of Manitoba mayors, the lack of funding (including federal funding for these very purposes) in schools, senior care facilities and daycares, to this day not bringing the military in to assist in devastated care facilities, closing of vital testing sites in September knowing full well the second wave was on us (I have more if you want them) all come down to one thing....Pallister did not do his job. Pallister failed. Lives were lost because Pallister stuck his head in the sand. People died. A lot more people are going to die, not because of an accident or a mistake but because of incompetence.  
 
It really doesn't matter though as our opinions will be accounted for on ballots which, if things continue in this manner, will be sooner rather than later. There are many who can be blamed for the situation we are in right now, from people who refused to simply mask up to the prime minister. The difference between you and I and Pallister is that he gets paid for unethically hiking up Hydro rates in the middle of a pandemic, putting the economy before lives and disregarding the people who elected him to office.  
 
I respect your right to defend him. Please respect others' right to research, educate themselves, listen to the experts and voice their opinion in opposition. People who are blaming him aren't merely shrugging off their own poor choices or playing the blame game. They are very correct in their anger and frustration at a government who has failed us all.

don't blame the government for our being placed into shut down. I do however blame the Pallister government for the poor choices and lack of critical decisions that have led to over a hundred deaths in this Province, hospitalizations, wide spread illness, businesses being shut down, large unemployment, house foreclosures. You speak of fear and mental illness. Do you think any of the above mentioned may have played a hand in that?  
 
Edited by Gussins, 2020-11-13 02:28:44

I have trouble understanding why people are so quick to jump to the defense of a government who at every step have mismanaged pandemic response with empty gestures and a reluctance to make difficult or unpopular choices.  
 
I've noticed many who complain our society is too lenient and coddling are the first ones to defend the politicians when they are criticized and there's talk of accountability. These people sought out these positions of power and authority in our society. They are well-compensated. They are doing a bad job. Their responsibility is to lead, create, and implement policy that benefits Manitobans, and they are failing miserably, particularly when it comes to the most vulnerable in our society. They have access to the resources and invested with the authority that can save lives, and they are choosing not to use them. Whether it's a conscious decision or not, they are choosing money and ideology over people's lives. Note to their defenders: If push comes to shove, they won't care you spoke up for them, they'll leave you in the dirt too.  
 
The debt argument is ridiculous, particularly the Won't Someone Please Think of the Children angle. I'm imagining my own kid in twenty years. Would they be more upset at inheriting debt created to prevent needless death and suffering, or knowing that a lot of people were sacrificed, possibly people they know and love, because money trumps all? If the former, I will have failed completely as a parent. If the latter - and it does appear government policy is going that way - why on earth would anyone with a heart and a brain want to live in a place where the government and so many of our fellow citizens considered some lives as disposable?  
 
Maybe the better off should start paying their fair share of taxes. Maybe our government should stop giving big businesses incentives - welfare's bad, except when it's for companies - and buying jobs with taxpayer dollars. Maybe it's time to admit that living in a society requires investment in human beings, rather than elevating the philosophy of Winner Take All and the Devil Takes The Hindmost to the level of gospel.  
 
Fishin' Guy, sorry to hear about your kid. I wonder where they learned their Got Mine attitude from.

but that statement is incorrect. Just one example of hundreds of similar articles out there.  
 
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/manitoba-covid-red-analysis-1.5781256

For those that actually follow the news.  
The warnings of a major pandemic of some kind have been out there for some years so you could say that the public and businesses should have taken responsibility and prepared themselves more. I was always taught that you never know what’s around the corner and you can never count on where your next dollar comes from.

the blaming? This isn't about one political party would have done better in regards to the virus.  
 
Gussins, Pallister was fighting as were his counterparts for more health care money from the Feds, which by the way he didn't get. Not his fault Trudeau didn't comply with the request.

and the leaders should have been prepared.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/feds-to-deliver-more-than-19b-to-provinces-and-territories-in-covid-19-support-1.5027090  
 
And this little gem:  
 
https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/described-as-sickening-winnipeg-mayor-calls-for-military-support-after-deadly-weekend-at-maples-care-home-1.5180803  
 
We do not have the luxury of time for an investigation or survey. These care facilities need assistance now! And this isn't about party lines, this is about incompetence.  
 
Edited by Gussins, 2020-11-13 08:43:35

But government (whatever party) can’t and should not be expected to do everything. The government role at the early signs of virus in China should have been to shut down international travel and impose movement restrictions, shut down no essential business and mandate mask wearing. ( which I called for on this forum in February). That was the biggest failing of many governments worried about the economy, manufacturing and the airline industry. Well here we are, they lay in tatters anyway and people are suffering and dying needlessly . We are all responsible for the situation that we find ourselves in right now and we have a responsibility to each other to follow regulations and protocols to get through this.

been going on for awhile , governments don't care much about older people.  
 
Canada has done a far worse job of protecting nursing-home residents from the coronavirus than other wealthy countries, according to a new analysis that shows the places that fared best made sweeping changes at seniors’ facilities as soon as they shut their societies down.  
 
Just over 80 per cent of Canada’s known COVID-19 deaths were in residents of nursing or retirement homes as of May 25, nearly double the average for countries in the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development, says a new report from Canada’s health care statistics agency.