Discussions

There is a reason why I don't even attempt to "Recycle" plastic shopping bags. If they are recycled, it's hardly a loop. A carpet, a shirt, a bench . . .  
And that is IF it is recycled. If you haden't figured it out yet, that is a giant if.  
 
I used to think that plastic recycling was like prayer (it feels positive without needing to actually do something), but it's more like gambling.  
 
Will this shopping bag become a new sweater? Or will it end up in a 30-foot pile of other bags in Malaysia?  
 
https://www.ecowatch.com/us-recycling-industry-2652630035.html

Every thousand mile march has a first step, that’s us putting our recyclables where they belong. We can only control our own actions and hope that problems down stream are picked upon and resolved properly as they need to be.

What is the difference between plastic grocery bags and let's say bread bags or black plastic bags or all the plastic that paper towels , tpaper are wrapped in . with the grocery bags they can at lease get used for several uses .Not trying to be snotty just wondering .

I do agree many things are not recycled as we believe, takes much energy to recycle them etc.  
 
BUT why not try to use less? I bring my own bags to stores or re-use them for my own garbage cans. Re-use bread bags as I can to store food in fridge etc.  
 
There are many things we cannot avoid as so many things are packaged in plastic but I try to purchase larger containers instead of multiples etc.

I had been faithfully saving plastic from all kinds of products - toilet paper, paper towel, cucumbers, lettuce, pasta, rice, candy, ziplocs etc etc - and taking them to Sobeys where there was a drum in the front entrance that I understood was for recycling them!  
 
I believed that I was doing an excellent job of making sure all of our plastic didn’t end up in the land fill!  
 
One day recently, I decided I would ask a manager just exactly where this plastic was going to be properly recycled.  
 
I was told it wasn’t.  
 
And I was disgusted.  
 
 
I was informed that it went another small organization for them to use the shopping bags for clients. Only the bags.  
 
10% of what I dropped off was shopping bags, because I use reusable bags all of the time. The remaining 90% therefore was being thrown out!! I was mortified.  
 
So we have no options here as far as I understand, because we don’t have plastic recycling at our recycling depot and bags/wrap-type plastics are not gathered there and sent to be or properly recycled.  
 
None.  
 
And that’s pretty unfortunate.

The only truly effective option is a major change in food packaging away from throwaway plastics. Plastic packaging didn’t used to be available . We used paper bags and wrapping among other things. Real meaningful change is going to require a total attitude adjustment and a return to packaging, food preparation and storage methods used by previous generations.

Yes.

I had previously switched to reusable bags some time ago, but I stopped last march when the earth went glove and scrub crazy. If I recall, many stores didn't want you to bring them in anyways. So now, I have at least a 6 months supply worth of grocery garbage bags again lol. I say 6 months because that was how long it took me to get rid of them all last time (deliveries in a bag, forgetting the bags, impulse purchases, etc).  
 
Now that we know that surfaces are not as big of a deal as we thought (well, make sure to sanitize the bags anyway. Ecoli and Salmonella will always be a threat!), I suppose breaking out the reusables isn't a bad idea. You just have to pack your own stuff, which can be tedious. But it also results in at least 5 fewer bags required per shopping trip.  
 
But I agree with the sentiment of many posters . . . the only way to fix this will be to rethink packaging. And honestly, to shift the burden of its disposal from us consumers and onto the producers that are dumping these products into the marketplace to begin with.  
 
There was a time not long ago when I had stopped recycling ALL plastics as a way of ensuring that I don't contribute to the piles overseas. I've since relaxed this since resin numbers 1 and 2 seem to have a market (4, 5 and 7 are also accepted according to the following):  
 
https://www.brandon.ca/images/pdf/Sanitation/Brandon_Recycling_Guide_MMSM.pdf  
 
I remain of the opinion that we should not be the ones paying for this. In most cases, it's not like the consumer has much choice.  
 
Try buying dish soap without plastic.  
 
Edited by Simonwalcal, 2021-04-26 16:23:24

The consumer is responsible and must ultimately pay the price of disposal. The consumers demand for convenience drove the demand for this packaging. Consumerism is absolutely the cause of all waste and the way to reduce waste is to raise cost to the consumer encouraging them to buy and waste less. It’s a truth that no one wants to hear .  
 
Edited by Farmergeorge, 2021-04-26 20:09:23

"It's a truth that no one wants to hear"  
 
Okay, where do I buy dish soap without a plastic bottle.  
 
-Shampoo/name the detergent  
 
- frozen Veg/anything  
 
- toothpaste  
 
Consumers DO want convenience, but buying less plastic slash creating less waste is easier said then done. For example, have you ever shopped many dollar store items?  
 
All I want is a chocolate bar. Its my fault that its plastic, over plastic, OVER PLASTIC?  
 
There is blame to be shared. But the plastic industry know full well that they well selling a tall tail when they launched the recycling programs along side the ever growing number of plastic items. Consumers were indeed lulled into a false sense of unrestrained consumption by the thought that it's all circular. But you can't help when you were being lied to.  
 
Do we need to change? Yes.  
 
Are we alone in the blame? No.

Each and every one of us has a hand in the blame but ultimately consumer choices and habits drive the demand. Just because the consumer has been lied to does not negate our responsibility to strive for improvement and change.  
When I buy an oil filter, a jug of oil or antifreeze there is always an environmental fee added , rising according to jug size . We recycle all of these used containers and the used product through a specialized company.  
The carbon tax is slowly increasing the price of fuel and energy in a bid to reduce usage.  
If we pay an environmental fee on these than why is that not the case on grocery , food , detergent packaging and household goods to enhance recycling efforts and generate different consumer choices.  
Slowly alternative packaging , bottles and containers are becoming available. One of our local stores is only packing into paper bags so that is where we shop.  
It isn’t easy, I have said for years that everyone should have to visit and tour a large landfill at least once in their lives. When you experience first hand the shear waste and destruction that humanity is generating it changes your attitude .  
This is caused directly by the shopping, spending and living habits of all consumers and they are the only ones that can change that.  
 
Edited by Farmergeorge, 2021-04-27 05:15:57

I think you're being simplistic. Absolutely consumer choices plays a role, but the companies themselves, and specifically their marketing, plays a significant role too.  
 
We live in a society, and an economy, that relies on constant growth. That constant growth is achieved by convincing us that we always need the newest, the best, the latest. Packaging plays a role in that.  
 
Our choices, as consumers, is shaped and guided by the companies themselves. That doesn't negate the power of our choice, but surely you see that our choice is dictated and mediated by the choices those companies are willing to give us. The small "recycling fee" we pay is lip service - it only covers a fraction of the true cost.  
 
In a lot of ways, it's just another marketing ploy.

I am being simplistic because it is simple enough. Of course consumer choice is directed by companies marketing and the economy relies on constant growth, this lifestyle is unsustainable. That’s the whole point. If real change is going to occur to reduce waste and pollution and if energy use is to be reduced then constant economic growth is no longer an option. This is reality. We all have to change the way that we live and give up the conveniences and luxuries to which we have become accustomed. The problem is that most people are not willing , but eventually this will be forced upon us.  
The consumer must make sustainable choices in their lives where possible, the rest of the economy will then follow suit.  
 
Edited by Farmergeorge, 2021-04-27 11:49:09

You can literally find almost everything plastic free.  
 
Lush is a great source for shampoo and conditioner bars and even solid lotion and perfume. Lush also has toothpaste tabs too.  
 
You can get these locally also at 2 farm kids and headleys health hut. They have the shampoo/conditioner bars, deodorant paste on glass jars, and toothpaste tabs also in glass jars.  
 
You can even get laundry detergent sheets from Tru Earth (online, Canadian) save plastic jugs.  
 
Also we are planet earth (also online and Canadian) has refills for bathroom cleaner, glass cleaner and all purpose.  
 
There's alternatives for everything of you are willing to look for it.

I stumbled on this short (15 min) documentary by NPR about recycling. It addresses a lot of the issues discussed in this thread, including "wishcycling" and the role marketing plays.  
 
https://youtu.be/iBGZtNJAt-M