Discussions

I felt this post needed to be addressed, I know I will have both Negative as well as Positive responses which I am expecting.  
 
I feel Manitoba Housing is a Blessing to many families in need of a roof over their heads without it charging an arm and a leg. We all fall on hard times now and again, people will always have their opinions of people living in Manitoba Housing which is their right, yet on the other hand until you are placed in that situation you can't really understand.  
 
My Issue is the following:  
People that are in Manitoba Housing that are also on Social Assistance that are taking advantage of both. Being on Social Assistance to many is hard enough but it is when people say they can't work but really can, they have things they don't claim or let housing or assistance know about. Some people take pride in their yards yet others don't care because it is Housing.  
I commend people who are in housing that go out each and everyday to do all they can for their family, it is the ones that manipulate and use the system that bother me.  
To all the one's who never stop trying I take my hat off to you, I also do not look down on you, It is the bad apples that make it hard on all the others.  
To those people I say grow a set and stop making the system worse than it is, because of you people on Assistance and In Housing are given a bad name. Don't point fingers at others, look in the mirror and take a deep look at what you see, at one time you were a proud individual who always wanted to better themselves yet now you just sit back and make a bad situation worse.  
 
Just remember not everyone in Housing and/or on assistance is in the same boat. There is many admirable people who still believe in hard work as well as being honorable.

As noted a lot of people truly need a hand up but I find it very interesting how a family can have a home in low income housing but have Harley's to drive. a car is one thing but to have a 'toy' like the ones I've seen is another. Perhaps the insurance to cover should go to rent or a mortgage. I am only saying this in response to the numerous complaints of how long the waiting lists are.

There will always be some who find a way to take advantage of what ever they can!  
 
But.....  
 
 
Once you get into Manitoba Housing and are in the work force. Your rent goes up every time you get a raise. For a lot of people that traps them into remaining in this housing.  
 
Why move to another rental unit that might cost more? Why not stay where you are and buy your family more toys? Why bother saving for a house with all the extra costs.... besides the down payment, there is lawyer fee, survey fee, repair cost, improvement cost, maybe even a water bill you never had to pay before.  
 
I think Manitoba Housing/ or government needs to build in some sort of incentive to give a willing tenant a helping hand to move on with their lives. I have no suggestion what that might be. Probably only a small amount of tenants would take part in this. But it would open up some housing.

Yes I understand that when their income increases so does their rent which does make it hard for them to get out of the rut, it's the double dippers, the ones that say I can't work, or I can't find work that get me, many people not on assistance find it hard to get by never mind buying "toys" yet for some miraculous reason there are the non-workers that can afford what the working class can't.  
Yet there are the ones that can't or won't work (won't claim) are finding a money tree (working under the table). Maybe slog more stricter guidelines, as well as more visiting the homes of these double dippers will put a halt to the madness.

if they cant work they should have to provide a Dr. note from at least 2 Drs.

There will always be abuse as people find ways to circumvent the rules. I know of someone on SA who lives in Mb housing. She has 3 children by 3 different fathers. She has a boyfriend who makes over 60000/yr. She cannot or chooses not to work. I know of many single moms who work,pay rent and day care But this person chooses differently. Her boyfriend maintains a residence under his name so that she does not have to claim a higher rent. Their combined rent is less than the average Brandon rent as he has just a very small place. They eat out constantly and I do not mean to McDonald's. They like upper scale restaurants. It bothers me as he is there 90% of his free time. Including over night. They get away with it because they will follow some of the rules but still are abusing the system

I understand both of the need and abusing it.  
But if you actually calculate it out working on minimum wage $11.00 you are not getting ahead.  
By the time they take off all the taxes off your pay you be making about maybe $1,100  
I mean your rent was say $400 then your working so they jack it up to $600  
Then on top of all that you have to pay for before and after school program and lunch program for just one child a month is $207 each and every month bc your working now and double and triple if you have more children  
Plus if you work till night you have to find someone to babysit and on weekends as well that would be another $100 or so  
Then your other bills on top you heat, electic, water be another what $200 or more  
I mean that is 1,100 right there and you didn't even buy any groceries yet  
So not everyone is lazy or bums and can't work it's the fact that they are in poverty as it is but if they work a minimum job they will be worse off then where they are now  
So I understand where some people are coming from

gracie22 said "I understand both of the need and abusing it.   But if you actually calculate it out working on minimum wage $11.00 you are not getting ahead.   By the time they take off all the taxes off your pay you be making about maybe $1,100   I mean your rent was say $400 then your working so they jack it up to $600   Then on top of all that you have to pay for before and after school program and lunch program for just one child a month is $207 each and every month bc your working now and double and triple if you have more children   Plus if you work till night you have to find someone to babysit and on weekends as well that would be another $100 or so   Then your other bills on top you heat, electic, water be another what $200 or more   I mean that is 1,100 right there and you didn't even buy any groceries yet   So not everyone is lazy or bums and can't work it's the fact that they are in poverty as it is but if they work a minimum job they will be worse off then where they are now   So I understand where some people are coming from "

We live in our own place, and also have the same bills. So it doesn't matter if you live in Man. Housing or not. A friend of mine lived in housing for a couple of years. She had 2 children, and roomed with another girl who had 1 child. One worked days )and one worked other shifts so babysitting was barely needed. (they both furthered their education by distance ed)  
My friend now lives in her own house and has a very good paying job, while her friend has a very GOOD job in alta.  
Yes, housing help is needed but too often abused by some. I think there should be a time limit on how long you live there.  
(i know of a family of 5 that moved into one 17yrs ago. Their children are long gone but they are still there???)  

You may not agree with this person's lifestyle choices but a lot of the factors you described here would not and should not affect the mother's ability to qualify for benefits or MB housing.  
 
A boyfriend who does not live with her and is not the father of her children doesn't have any responsibility for supporting her or her children, paying her rent, putting clothes on the kids and food on the table. What he makes does not fall into the equation and if he is paying for meals out and paying for his own apartment then none of that has anything to do with her eligibility for social assistance.  
 
The mother and father(s) are solely responsible for supporting those three kids. It doesn't matter what the neighbors or other people think - the boyfriend has nothing to do with it.  
 
It would seem to me that he is likely to be paying for all of these extras, and since you say he has a decent income, then he has every right to do what he pleases with the money he earned. If he wants to take his girlfriend out for dinner every night, it's nobody's business and certainly no reason to think the girlfriend is playing the system.  
 
Accepting help from a social program doesn't open every aspect of a person's lifestyle to public scrutiny. Maybe she's lazy or maybe she made some poor choices earlier in life. Maybe she could get a job, support herself and the kids - but if she is a single parent of three children it will be almost impossible without some help. The road is pretty hard and there aren't a lot of incentives to do the 'right' thing the way society thinks she should. She could have all 3 kids in subsidized daycare so she can work 40-50 hour weeks at minimum wage and in the end it may not even improve her financial situation.  
 
If working was all it took to get a family off of social assistance, then I am sure more people would do it. But that is often not the case. As things are now, it will often increase the family's cost of living while decreasing the help available to them. The way the system inadvertently discourages self-sufficiency is a bigger part of the problem than the 'abusers'.  
 
 
 

Many point fingers at the social welfare recipients, but are not aware of the amount of money given to the corporations so their shareholders can buy more toys. I think that before we dis on the few people that might cost us a nickle or two, we should first of all question the variou corporate welfare programs that are costs us millions to people that do not need it.  
 
"They are able to work" is difficult to determine if you do not know their situation. I would like to see more spent on case workers who have regular sessions with the recipients and help them work on a plan to get them off social assistance. I understand the only government employee the recipient sees now is the clerical staff to help fill in the right forms and process the cheques.  
 
There needs to be money spent on hiring the staff to work on resolving the underlying reasons for the clients to be on social assistance in the first place. It may take five to ten years to see a return on this kind of investment and any politician that takes this approach is usually voted out before the savings become noticeable to the taxpayers.

Life is hard for everyone, I have to agree with more of the social based thinkers, that it's hard when you have a disability or have kids and people think you should work. My partner is on disability and so are some of my friends. Most have tried and failed to get off social assistance because cost of living is horribly high. I make more than minimum wage and after paying bills and food there is rarely anything left. I think that an incentive program would be great but we aren't Sweden or many of the European countries that have great programs for people who need the help. We can all sit here day after day and complain but it's not going to help when we have a very broken system all over.

my22cents said "if they cant work they should have to provide a Dr. note from at least 2 Drs. "

This is also a good idea that should be done monthly if it comes down to it. Plus they should be charged for the Drs. Note.  

are there going to be more assistance needed in the future this is going cost a lot. I believe few may apply but I know some do not quick their butt for effort and improve, much easier for excuses.  
I know a person that says can't work but last 3-4 years Ive known this person well he knows how to use and play with people and can control his temper when he wants too so my opinion (yes just my opinion) he can work.  
One girl with assistance not much money but why pay a $300 ticket for concert that should be least priority. Other storie but can't name them all.

sad mom said "There will always be abuse as people find ways to circumvent the rules. I know of someone on SA who lives in Mb housing. She has 3 children by 3 different fathers. She has a boyfriend who makes over 60000/yr. She cannot or chooses not to work. I know of many single moms who work,pay rent and day care But this person chooses differently. Her boyfriend maintains a residence under his name so that she does not have to claim a higher rent. Their combined rent is less than the average Brandon rent as he has just a very small place. They eat out constantly and I do not mean to McDonald's. They like upper scale restaurants. It bothers me as he is there 90% of his free time. Including over night. They get away with it because they will follow some of the rules but still are abusing the system "

Unfortunately this is an ongoing issue that no matter what rules and regulations are put into place people will always find a way to get past that so they can still benefit.  
As mentioned before there are two types of people that are on Social Assistance and or In Manitoba Housing, Those that have fallen on hard times or are single parents raising children on their own and people that love receiving without lifting a finger. Its the ones that use the system that overload the system.  
At one time people took pride in knowing they were able to support themselves and their family, now it is lets take the easy road and not give a damn.  
You will have people in housing or on Assistance that bust their butts daily, whether it looking for work or working to make ends meet. Then their are the freeloaders who have their bf or gf who makes a decent income staying in housing yet are not on the list of people on the agreement. That also annoys me as there is such a waiting list for people who are truly in need of housing but cant get in.

gracie22 said "I understand both of the need and abusing it.   But if you actually calculate it out working on minimum wage $11.00 you are not getting ahead.   By the time they take off all the taxes off your pay you be making about maybe $1,100   I mean your rent was say $400 then your working so they jack it up to $600   Then on top of all that you have to pay for before and after school program and lunch program for just one child a month is $207 each and every month bc your working now and double and triple if you have more children   Plus if you work till night you have to find someone to babysit and on weekends as well that would be another $100 or so   Then your other bills on top you heat, electic, water be another what $200 or more   I mean that is 1,100 right there and you didn't even buy any groceries yet   So not everyone is lazy or bums and can't work it's the fact that they are in poverty as it is but if they work a minimum job they will be worse off then where they are now   So I understand where some people are coming from "

I agree not everyone is in the same boat, yet there is the abusers, the ones who have other people living with them who are not entitled to be living there, a single Mom for instance trying to make a new start yet no matter how hard she tries she is spinning her tires on the ice.

Starhc said "You may not agree with this person's lifestyle choices but a lot of the factors you described here would not and should not affect the mother's ability to qualify for benefits or MB housing.     A boyfriend who does not live with her and is not the father of her children doesn't have any responsibility for supporting her or her children, paying her rent, putting clothes on the kids and food on the table. What he makes does not fall into the equation and if he is paying for meals out and paying for his own apartment then none of that has anything to do with her eligibility for social assistance.     The mother and father(s) are solely responsible for supporting those three kids. It doesn't matter what the neighbors or other people think - the boyfriend has nothing to do with it.     It would seem to me that he is likely to be paying for all of these extras, and since you say he has a decent income, then he has every right to do what he pleases with the money he earned. If he wants to take his girlfriend out for dinner every night, it's nobody's business and certainly no reason to think the girlfriend is playing the system.     Accepting help from a social program doesn't open every aspect of a person's lifestyle to public scrutiny. Maybe she's lazy or maybe she made some poor choices earlier in life. Maybe she could get a job, support herself and the kids - but if she is a single parent of three children it will be almost impossible without some help. The road is pretty hard and there aren't a lot of incentives to do the 'right' thing the way society thinks she should. She could have all 3 kids in subsidized daycare so she can work 40-50 hour weeks at minimum wage and in the end it may not even improve her financial situation.     If working was all it took to get a family off of social assistance, then I am sure more people would do it. But that is often not the case. As things are now, it will often increase the family's cost of living while decreasing the help available to them. The way the system inadvertently discourages self-sufficiency is a bigger part of the problem than the 'abusers'.         "

I myself have seen many people come and go out of housing in our community, many are from different communities wanting a fresh start after an abusive relationship, the only housing available is in another community which means they uproot their family, travel to a community that may not have alot of employment opportunities which makes it hard for them to find employment.  
Then along comes the bad apples, the ones that have no remorse of what they are doing to make the system more overloaded. The ones that work only under the table so they don't have to claim the income, the ones that have all the vehicles, pools etc. Yet its still not enough, they want more.  
 
When a person who is not the parent of children in a MB Housing appears in the picture is one thing when that person is involved in overloading the system with dishonesty is another, especially if the children are on the short end of the stick in regards to needs etc.

katwalk1909 said "Many point fingers at the social welfare recipients, but are not aware of the amount of money given to the corporations so their shareholders can buy more toys. I think that before we dis on the few people that might cost us a nickle or two, we should first of all question the variou corporate welfare programs that are costs us millions to people that do not need it.     "They are able to work" is difficult to determine if you do not know their situation. I would like to see more spent on case workers who have regular sessions with the recipients and help them work on a plan to get them off social assistance. I understand the only government employee the recipient sees now is the clerical staff to help fill in the right forms and process the cheques.     There needs to be money spent on hiring the staff to work on resolving the underlying reasons for the clients to be on social assistance in the first place. It may take five to ten years to see a return on this kind of investment and any politician that takes this approach is usually voted out before the savings become noticeable to the taxpayers. "

Oh i do agree there is some in corporation that also abuse the system and to me that is wrong also as they are also a reason for the problems.  
It seems like the dripping faucet will eventually overflow the sink.

RainaRo said "Life is hard for everyone, I have to agree with more of the social based thinkers, that it's hard when you have a disability or have kids and people think you should work. My partner is on disability and so are some of my friends. Most have tried and failed to get off social assistance because cost of living is horribly high. I make more than minimum wage and after paying bills and food there is rarely anything left. I think that an incentive program would be great but we aren't Sweden or many of the European countries that have great programs for people who need the help. We can all sit here day after day and complain but it's not going to help when we have a very broken system all over. "

There are a select few that are very admirable, being on disability is hard enough, the emotional and physical roller coaster ride is one thing, making a living is another. Not everyone is taking the easy road.  
The system is beyond broken, duct tape cant fix all the problems with the system as well it is not a quick fix to something that has been going on for some time

D.H. said "    my22cents said "if they cant work they should have to provide a Dr. note from at least 2 Drs. " This is also a good idea that should be done monthly if it comes down to it. Plus they should be charged for the Drs. Note.   "

If this is a requirement then that is causing unnecessary strain on our healthcare system, unnecessary expense for taxpayers, etc. Why charge someone who is in need of financial assistance for a doctor's note? I am not living month to month but I sure don't like shelling out $50 for a note for a doctor. I can't imagine why that would be practical for a person who is having trouble making ends meet, is obviously unemployed already (or going to be soon) and has limited income.  
 
So, they won't be able to afford to pay it and probably won't. Or they won't be able to get services and help they need because they can't get a doctor's note. How does any of that make sense? It would just be a hurdle for those who legitimately need help, while those who abuse the system would still find a way around it by doctor-shopping until they get a diagnosis, using clinics that don't charge, or neglecting to pay the fee at the doctor's office.  
 
Meanwhile, you have actual sick people waiting in line for hours to see a doctor, or waiting weeks for an appointment while someone is waiting for a monthly note so they can keep their benefits?  
 
No, thanks. I wish people who have too much money were scrutinized as much as people who are living on assistance. Do we sit around thinking they don't deserve what they have or accuse them of not working hard enough for it? No, we assume anyone who has lots of money deserves all of it, we never connect the dots. We pay a little or a lot more for things we need, we get paid a little less at work, some people are happy to do the work of two or three people because they are glad not to have their position cut - all to benefit the bottom line of people who already have enough.  
 
We don't worry about that, though. We always blame anyone who doesn't have money for not trying hard enough and taking what we think is ours.  
 
I agree the system needs an overhaul because it is broken, but the reason to do so is to do a better job helping people who need it. If people want to take pressure off the working/middle class then they're looking in the wrong direction.  
 
 
 
 
Edited by Starhc, 2015-10-14 20:52:13

I don't think a dr's note even from 2 dr's would serve any purpose. Most people know which dr's give out notes! Having said that,I don't know of any that charge $50.00. The usual is $10.00 or free.  
I can't see how picking apart people who have money in any way helps those who need social assistance.  
I've not seen anything on this thread "bashing" those in need of assistance. The thrust of this as I understand it is about the number of people abusing a system that's in place to help those who need it.

It isn't about picking them apart, it is about being very clear about where money is needed and where it is concentrated. People who have lots of money (not just people who are doing well, but the actual WEALTHY people, who are a tiny percentage of the population who have 70% of our country's wealth) are the ones who are also taking *much* more than they contribute to society. We don't call them abusers, we call them lucky, or hard-working, or brilliant, or talented. They may very well be some or all of those things, but they clearly don't contribute as much as they gain. We don't question their choices or contributions even though they have far more impact on our ability to earn a good living and have a better quality of life.  
 
Many people do worry about those who have very little money 'abusing' a system that is in place to help the poor and disadvantaged. The abuse of the system is often the reason people say it is broken. The real reason to overhaul the system is not to save the money wasted by abusers, it is to do a better job providing for those who need assistance!  
 
Yes, there are people who believe very strongly that the 'abusers' are a huge drain on public resources and that they are the reason why the middle class and working class have it so hard. It is difficult to convince people that providing the basics and lifting those people up is the way to make things better for everyone.

anyone can judge, that takes no ability or intelligence.  
 
True genius is to critique and present a solution. No one has been able to present a solution since the first "social assistance abuser" was identified. There is no solution.  
 
Save governmental monies where we can and slow the bleeding in other areas is the best that can be done. Why are we not talking about the ostentatious pensions MP's receive after only a few years in office. That would immediately save billions of $$ What about farming subsidies, slow that wound to save billions more. Why not scrap the Indian Act, save billions more $$. Now that would accomplish something. But creating homeless people should not be a priority; more importantly, homeless children whom do not get to choose their parents.  
 
Thoughts???  
 

why don't we make government responsible for cost over runs on Manitoba Housing. Why does it cost them $250,000 per unit to build when a private company can build the exact same unit for $175,000. the difference between real life construction and government construction would support the family in said unit for several years. Just make them accountable for the costs......more millions saved  
 
The answers are out there, just not in the exact location you want them to be.  

Starhc said "    D.H. said "    my22cents said "if they cant work they should have to provide a Dr. note from at least 2 Drs. " This is also a good idea that should be done monthly if it comes down to it. Plus they should be charged for the Drs. Note.   " If this is a requirement then that is causing unnecessary strain on our healthcare system, unnecessary expense for taxpayers, etc. Why charge someone who is in need of financial assistance for a doctor's note? I am not living month to month but I sure don't like shelling out $50 for a note for a doctor. I can't imagine why that would be practical for a person who is having trouble making ends meet, is obviously unemployed already (or going to be soon) and has limited income.     So, they won't be able to afford to pay it and probably won't. Or they won't be able to get services and help they need because they can't get a doctor's note. How does any of that make sense? It would just be a hurdle for those who legitimately need help, while those who abuse the system would still find a way around it by doctor-shopping until they get a diagnosis, using clinics that don't charge, or neglecting to pay the fee at the doctor's office.     Meanwhile, you have actual sick people waiting in line for hours to see a doctor, or waiting weeks for an appointment while someone is waiting for a monthly note so they can keep their benefits?     No, thanks. I wish people who have too much money were scrutinized as much as people who are living on assistance. Do we sit around thinking they don't deserve what they have or accuse them of not working hard enough for it? No, we assume anyone who has lots of money deserves all of it, we never connect the dots. We pay a little or a lot more for things we need, we get paid a little less at work, some people are happy to do the work of two or three people because they are glad not to have their position cut - all to benefit the bottom line of people who already have enough.     We don't worry about that, though. We always blame anyone who doesn't have money for not trying hard enough and taking what we think is ours.     I agree the system needs an overhaul because it is broken, but the reason to do so is to do a better job helping people who need it. If people want to take pressure off the working/middle class then they're looking in the wrong direction.           Edited by Starhc, 2015-10-14 20:52:13"

I can appreciate your view and input, yet the strain that this would cause the Health Care System is no more that what is put on already.  
 
As for Manitoba Housing and Social Assistance the strain that is already put on is beyond fixing with Bandages or Duct Tape. There are people in Housing and/or on assistance that bust there busts to support their families.  
I admire many single parents starting fresh with their children its the ones that use the system makes it bad for everyone. Not to mention these freeloaders as some call it that Can't work or choose not to bother me as their children, the next generation of taking advantage of the system not thinking anything is wrong with it as their parent (s) did it.  
Then you have the ones that take pride in their MB Housing that they go above and beyond making their home and yard look amazing. Then you come cross the ones that decide their yard is a cross between a junk yard, used car lot and Spa. Yet where did the money come from, it sure isn't donated. Then they still go and put a sob story of not enough food in the fridge, etc. So they can afford all these extra toys yet cant afford food, Good thing their is places who support struggling families with food as to may that don't need to be there are taking from the people that truly need it.  

MDG said "I don't think a dr's note even from 2 dr's would serve any purpose. Most people know which dr's give out notes! Having said that,I don't know of any that charge $50.00. The usual is $10.00 or free.   I can't see how picking apart people who have money in any way helps those who need social assistance.   I've not seen anything on this thread "bashing" those in need of assistance. The thrust of this as I understand it is about the number of people abusing a system that's in place to help those who need it. "

i have heard many people say its easy to get a Drs. Note which they will pay and be reimbursed. Many Drs. have no issues writing notes you just tell them your pain etc. poof Drs note.  
 
with each option brought to the table one must also the odd one is finding i way to make it benefit him/her,,,,,, so just when a bandage covers up one hole another appears.

lamper said "As noted a lot of people truly need a hand up but I find it very interesting how a family can have a home in low income housing but have Harley's to drive. a car is one thing but to have a 'toy' like the ones I've seen is another. Perhaps the insurance to cover should go to rent or a mortgage. I am only saying this in response to the numerous complaints of how long the waiting lists are. "

It appears some that are in Manitoba Housing and/or on Social Assistance are like the rotten family members that just won't go away, the ones that brag about getting something for nothing while everyone else going by it honestly suffers.  
In a way they are like politicians where when their Mouth is Moving they are Lying. Thank Goodness there is still Honest people out there that claim everything they get, will go that extra mile etc. etc. yet do it the honest way. Hats go off to all that still follow the rules, I wish you the best and I feel for you, don't Give up.

if you aren't happy with the system of welfare and public housing then educate yourself so that you can provide your own necessities. In my opinion, Manitoba Public housing is to assist low income "earners" which implies that they have earned the money from employment and welfare is and should only be a temporary situation for all those that are physically and mentally able. And don't mock those that have taken the extra time and the hard work and did just that! And complain that they have too much money and don't deserve it. tsk tsk I myself worked and went to school with a toddler. It took me 10 years but I did it.  
 
Edited by Jaxon, 2015-10-20 13:52:30

I'm not living in MB housing or on social assistance. We work and provide for ourselves and our family. I don't need to get an education - I have a job and an education already.  
 
I also recognize that while I've worked and studied, not everyone has the advantages I was born with in life - two parents who worked, a home they owned, food on the table, clothes on our backs, etc. I learned my way by watching how they provided for us and trying to do the same for myself. How do you think children born into poverty learn? What do they see and what do they hope or expect for their own future?  
 
Poverty is a cycle. Some people are able to break free of poverty by working and educating themselves, but we do not make it easy for them. We make it easier for people who are born into poverty to stay in the cycle, to live they see others living, and to accept that as enough. So the cycle repeats.  
 
People can be as wealthy as they want, I am not complaining that they have too much money so much as answering to the people who look to those on social assistance and think that they are a drain on the resources of working people. We resist social spending because we think it is costing the working and middle class. We know that we worked for our money and we hate to see our tax dollars going to help those who are not helping themselves, like it is coming out of our own pockets and going to theirs. That is simply not how it works. In our society, the wealth is not being 'drained' by the poor people, it is flowing upstream.  
 
 
 
 

“You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friend, is the beginning of the end of any nation.. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.”

We have plenty of wealth in this nation, but it is concentrated in a very, very, very, very tiny percentage of the population. So what a handful of people have is equal to what the other 11 million people have.  
 
While I agree with the principle, it is way out of hand. For one, we don't have 'half' the population working and not paying and the other half paying for it. Nobody is talking about legislating the wealthy out of their money - make no mistake, they will still be very, very, very wealthy even if a fraction of their income is used to provide social services for those with the most need. The needy outnumber the wealthy but it does not take much of their wealth to address that problem. Check out the actual distribution vs. what people perceive or think is fair. What is actual is so far away from what we perceive and think is fair. People can still be successful and extremely wealthy. There will always be poor people. But the extremes are what is keeping everyone in between - the actual majority of the population (I will jump to assume, that means most of us here...) people from being as successful and stable as we should be.  
 
The problem most people have with the poor people is that they take more than they contribute. I am only asking that people consider for a moment who *else* is gaining far much more than they contribute to our country, and at what cost to the rest of us?  
 
And then, what party or government actually has an idea to address it? The answer there is, none of them because the citizens in the country are not asking them to. We need to start looking in the right direction to solve these problems because the middle class is getting stretched very thin. Of course we don't like it when expanding social programs is on the agenda. It feels like we're already doing more than enough and no progress is being made.