Discussions

People who make more money do get taxed more. That's how tax brackets work.  
 
I assume Fishin Guy is your real name?

That sound off attitude goes along nicely with the one that was on a fb feed about the topic. The guy literally said if the wages were froze expect crappy health care from the people afflicted by the freeze...like excuse me ? Ten I guess the minimum wage earners who serve your coffee or burgers should be able to what spit in your food because they didn't get a wage increase? Yes money makes the world go round but it sure as hell should not affect the level of service you get no matter where or what you are doing or getting paid to do. It's a horrible attitude and kinda scary really.

was a teacher in either case. In fact it sounded a lot like a person who used to post on eBrandon quite frequently. Posting crap like that is a great way to bring out the teacher haters and rile people up. I seems to have worked quite well.  
 
Kind of a double standard, Fishin Guy, complaining that someone else is not using their real name. I do agree with you that these are not the kind of people that I would want to see as teachers.

i cant read the sound off article but to address the anonymity concern, many professionals are under a nondisclosure clause, and even if they aren't making complaints public can have a backlash so i can understand why someone who is in the field may choose to stay anonymous, hopefully they also work on changes from the inside too but sadly thats not always the case  
 
do the budget increases only include teaching costs or do they include other costs? that would make a difference whether the increases are justified or not, one thing to consider tho is that many of the new students need special help like ELA ect making the cost to teach those students more then just your average increase, 32% more i doubt it but still a factor

I too believe that this person in the sound off is not a teacher. An increase in a degree means a jump to a new class level (6 or 7) and while there is an increase in pay, it is only for that year. after that, unless they are not at max, their increase in salary is only done at bargaining. But I agree, if this is a teacher, they should be ashamed of promoting "confrontational" language like they did.  
 
And budgets are not just teachers' salaries but the salaries of Superintendents, Division office staff, bus drivers/transportation expenses, EA's, secretaries, maintenance staff, janitorial staff, and any or all outside resource staff.  
 
Building upkeep, heating, fuel, supplies, educational resources, etc are all expenses as well. All of these things go up every year due to inflation and the suppliers costs. Wouldn't it be great if we could all agree to never raise the cost of anything again. lets just keep the price the same for all time and then there would never be a need for increases in pay or benefits. Then again, business owners would not become billionaires.

That these "sound offs" might not actually be made by a teacher, but by someone representing themselves as such to get people riled up? That's how I read it.

Riderpride44 said "I too believe that this person in the sound off is not a teacher. An increase in a degree means a jump to a new class level (6 or 7) and while there is an increase in pay, it is only for that year. after that, unless they are not at max, their increase in salary is only done at bargaining. But I agree, if this is a teacher, they should be ashamed of promoting "confrontational" language like they did.     And budgets are not just teachers' salaries but the salaries of Superintendents, Division office staff, bus drivers/transportation expenses, EA's, secretaries, maintenance staff, janitorial staff, and any or all outside resource staff.     Building upkeep, heating, fuel, supplies, educational resources, etc are all expenses as well. All of these things go up every year due to inflation and the suppliers costs. Wouldn't it be great if we could all agree to never raise the cost of anything again. lets just keep the price the same for all time and then there would never be a need for increases in pay or benefits. Then again, business owners would not become billionaires. "

Given the amount of time, effort, and money ($600-1,000 a course) to complete a Master''s degree, they really aren''t coming out on top, at least not for a while (to add to what you just pointed out re: salary caps).  
 
Edited by Jaim, 2017-03-31 12:41:35

Jaim said "    Riderpride44 said "I too believe that this person in the sound off is not a teacher. An increase in a degree means a jump to a new class level (6 or 7) and while there is an increase in pay, it is only for that year. after that, unless they are not at max, their increase in salary is only done at bargaining. But I agree, if this is a teacher, they should be ashamed of promoting "confrontational" language like they did.     And budgets are not just teachers' salaries but the salaries of Superintendents, Division office staff, bus drivers/transportation expenses, EA's, secretaries, maintenance staff, janitorial staff, and any or all outside resource staff.     Building upkeep, heating, fuel, supplies, educational resources, etc are all expenses as well. All of these things go up every year due to inflation and the suppliers costs. Wouldn't it be great if we could all agree to never raise the cost of anything again. lets just keep the price the same for all time and then there would never be a need for increases in pay or benefits. Then again, business owners would not become billionaires. " Given the amount of time, effort, and money ($600-1,000 a course) to complete a Master''s degree, they really aren''t coming out on top, at least not for a while (to add to what you just pointed out re: salary caps).     Edited by Jaim, 2017-03-31 12:41:35"

Not fully sure of the details but I don't recall a family member costing too much to upgrade with tax incentives and pretty sure there was funding available for upgrading studies bringing a minimal investment to get a much better return.

if you get training is paid for by the company. Teachers have to pay for their education out of pocket. I don't recall any hydro/mts/cn/cp employee having to pay to get further education.

I see complaints that unionized people get paid too much, that uneducated truck drivers get paid too much, that educated people get paid too much, that teachers get paid too much, and that teacher (or people representing as teachers) care too much about getting paid.  
 
Don't we ALL want to get paid? Aren't teachers professionals who have taken post secondary training and been found to have met a professional standard? They also have a responsibility to maintain their professional development, and god forbid they take more education and earn a higher classification!  
 
It seems to me that most people are selfish and self centred and we think WE don't get paid enough and OTHER PEOPLE get paid too much! How about appreciate the great teachers out there and if you think you can do better go to school, get your degree and your teaching certificate and go for it!

ScottRS said "People who make more money do get taxed more. That's how tax brackets work.     I assume Fishin Guy is your real name? "

my thoughts exactly...

brandongirlie said "    ScottRS said "People who make more money do get taxed more. That's how tax brackets work.     I assume Fishin Guy is your real name? " my thoughts exactly... "

The names Evan. There isn't a whole lot of difference in tax brackets when you look them up. So everyone is fine to just keep shelling out money to departments like this? You read on eBrandon all the time about where to find the cheapest this and that. I am not saying I want the cheapest but I would like to see how we can improve quality while keeping costs in line. Why can other provinces provide the same education at lower costs? Like I said student enrollment increased 8% over 5 years. Teacher costing has increased approx. 45% in the same 5 years. Division admin has increased 55%. Is everyone happy with the numbers? Let me ask the question.....At what point do the numbers become unsustainable? The BSD is a 90 million dollar budget. That is a lot of money for 1500 teachers and administration. 85% of that is wages. We will be pushing 100 million in less than a couple years. Next years taxes look for another increase. At what point to people start to question things?

Fishin Guy said "    brandongirlie said "    ScottRS said "People who make more money do get taxed more. That's how tax brackets work.     I assume Fishin Guy is your real name? " my thoughts exactly... " The names Evan. There isn't a whole lot of difference in tax brackets when you look them up. So everyone is fine to just keep shelling out money to departments like this? You read on eBrandon all the time about where to find the cheapest this and that. I am not saying I want the cheapest but I would like to see how we can improve quality while keeping costs in line. Why can other provinces provide the same education at lower costs? Like I said student enrollment increased 8% over 5 years. Teacher costing has increased approx. 45% in the same 5 years. Division admin has increased 55%. Is everyone happy with the numbers? Let me ask the question.....At what point do the numbers become unsustainable? The BSD is a 90 million dollar budget. That is a lot of money for 1500 teachers and administration. 85% of that is wages. We will be pushing 100 million in less than a couple years. Next years taxes look for another increase. At what point to people start to question things? "

Isn't that more than the city of Brandons?  
Holy!  
 
I know myself I have questioned but no one seems to care. The school board continues to raise taxes every single year.  
 
The BSD had better not announce a surplus this year like previous years! Or the ca-ca will hit the fan!

wonderment said "That sound off attitude goes along nicely with the one that was on a fb feed about the topic. The guy literally said if the wages were froze expect crappy health care from the people afflicted by the freeze...like excuse me ? Ten I guess the minimum wage earners who serve your coffee or burgers should be able to what spit in your food because they didn't get a wage increase? Yes money makes the world go round but it sure as hell should not affect the level of service you get no matter where or what you are doing or getting paid to do. It's a horrible attitude and kinda scary really. "

You make a great point. I have a number of friends who are school teachers and they are always complaining. I tell them go teach in the U.S. where teachers make half of what the Canadians do. Working 10 months a year and making north of $60,000 per year is more then generous

Fishin Guy said "    brandongirlie said "    ScottRS said "People who make more money do get taxed more. That's how tax brackets work.     I assume Fishin Guy is your real name? " my thoughts exactly... " The names Evan. There isn't a whole lot of difference in tax brackets when you look them up. So everyone is fine to just keep shelling out money to departments like this? You read on eBrandon all the time about where to find the cheapest this and that. I am not saying I want the cheapest but I would like to see how we can improve quality while keeping costs in line. Why can other provinces provide the same education at lower costs? Like I said student enrollment increased 8% over 5 years. Teacher costing has increased approx. 45% in the same 5 years. Division admin has increased 55%. Is everyone happy with the numbers? Let me ask the question.....At what point do the numbers become unsustainable? The BSD is a 90 million dollar budget. That is a lot of money for 1500 teachers and administration. 85% of that is wages. We will be pushing 100 million in less than a couple years. Next years taxes look for another increase. At what point to people start to question things? "

If your numbers are correct, 1500 teachers splitting $90 million, that works out to $60k per year per teacher. Now, that means there is $0 left over for ANYTHING! Even at that rate, I make more than a teacher and I only have a college diploma. Either your math is way off (shame on your math teacher) or you are throwing out false information.

PrimeConvoy said "    Fishin Guy said "    brandongirlie said "    ScottRS said "People who make more money do get taxed more. That's how tax brackets work.     I assume Fishin Guy is your real name? " my thoughts exactly... " The names Evan. There isn't a whole lot of difference in tax brackets when you look them up. So everyone is fine to just keep shelling out money to departments like this? You read on eBrandon all the time about where to find the cheapest this and that. I am not saying I want the cheapest but I would like to see how we can improve quality while keeping costs in line. Why can other provinces provide the same education at lower costs? Like I said student enrollment increased 8% over 5 years. Teacher costing has increased approx. 45% in the same 5 years. Division admin has increased 55%. Is everyone happy with the numbers? Let me ask the question.....At what point do the numbers become unsustainable? The BSD is a 90 million dollar budget. That is a lot of money for 1500 teachers and administration. 85% of that is wages. We will be pushing 100 million in less than a couple years. Next years taxes look for another increase. At what point to people start to question things? " If your numbers are correct, 1500 teachers splitting $90 million, that works out to $60k per year per teacher. Now, that means there is $0 left over for ANYTHING! Even at that rate, I make more than a teacher and I only have a college diploma. Either your math is way off (shame on your math teacher) or you are throwing out false information. "

https://www.bsd.ca/board/budgetfinance/Pages/default.aspx  
 
1500 staff according to the School division. My fault for relaying false information. Also the budget is $98,000,000 not $90 like I previously said. No shame on my math teacher, my math was taught in Alberta. No worries there. I get all my numbers directly from the Brandon School division reports. I don''t make up anything.  
 
Also average instructional time from Gr 1-8 is 27.5hrs per week. Most school days per year is 196.  
 
Average working days per year is 253.  
 
Edited by Fishin Guy, 2017-04-03 15:04:12

Johnbisonbear said "    Fishin Guy said "    brandongirlie said "    ScottRS said "People who make more money do get taxed more. That's how tax brackets work.     I assume Fishin Guy is your real name? " my thoughts exactly... " The names Evan. There isn't a whole lot of difference in tax brackets when you look them up. So everyone is fine to just keep shelling out money to departments like this? You read on eBrandon all the time about where to find the cheapest this and that. I am not saying I want the cheapest but I would like to see how we can improve quality while keeping costs in line. Why can other provinces provide the same education at lower costs? Like I said student enrollment increased 8% over 5 years. Teacher costing has increased approx. 45% in the same 5 years. Division admin has increased 55%. Is everyone happy with the numbers? Let me ask the question.....At what point do the numbers become unsustainable? The BSD is a 90 million dollar budget. That is a lot of money for 1500 teachers and administration. 85% of that is wages. We will be pushing 100 million in less than a couple years. Next years taxes look for another increase. At what point to people start to question things? " Isn't that more than the city of Brandons?   Holy!     I know myself I have questioned but no one seems to care. The school board continues to raise taxes every single year.     The BSD had better not announce a surplus this year like previous years! Or the ca-ca will hit the fan! "

I sent the school division at budget time voicing my frustration. There seems there is nothing that we as taxpayers can do. There is no accountability anywhere within the division. Short money...raise taxes. I explained it was even a waste of time to attend a budget meeting. We could all go in there with flaming pitchforks and nothing would change. The only thing that will change is the faces of the elected board. I laugh when they say "Good turnout at the budget meeting of teachers and students" Jesus the schools ask that teachers and students/parents attend. It is a tactic played so when you want to see budget justice they can point to little Suzie that has no idea why she should be there and tell you to think of this poor child's education and how you would be hurting her. You don't want to hurt her education do you? I don't have NDP Math blindness. 8% rise in students shouldn't equal 45% increase in wages. I don't care what math you have. Where is the justification in that?

Like I said student enrollment increased 8% over 5 years. Teacher costing has increased approx. 45% in the same 5 years. Division admin has increased 55%. Is everyone happy with the numbers?  
Looking at these two budgets:  
https://www.bsd.ca/board/budgetfinance/Documents/2017-2018%20-%20PSFB%20Frame%20Budget.pdf  
 
https://www.bsd.ca/board/budgetfinance/Documents/Frame%20Budget%20June%2030%202014.pdf  
 
Divisional Administration has gone from $2733k to $3372k. That is an increase of 23%  
 
Regular Instruction has gone from $51,689k to $61,575k. That is an increase of 19%  
 
Which areas increased by 45% and 55%?

ultraguy said "Like I said student enrollment increased 8% over 5 years. Teacher costing has increased approx. 45% in the same 5 years. Division admin has increased 55%. Is everyone happy with the numbers?   Looking at these two budgets:   https://www.bsd.ca/board/budgetfinance/Documents/2017-2018%20-%20PSFB%20Frame%20Budget.pdf     https://www.bsd.ca/board/budgetfinance/Documents/Frame%20Budget%20June%2030%202014.pdf     Divisional Administration has gone from $2733k to $3372k. That is an increase of 23%     Regular Instruction has gone from $51,689k to $61,575k. That is an increase of 19%     Which areas increased by 45% and 55%? "

Indicates the first link is for 2016, second is for 2014 so the percentage calculated is the increase over TWO years not five...

The first one is for the fiscal year ending in 2018, the second link is for the fiscal year ending in 2014.  
 
Edited by ultraguy, 2017-04-03 16:38:19

Fishin Guy said "    Johnbisonbear said "    Fishin Guy said "    brandongirlie said "    ScottRS said "People who make more money do get taxed more. That's how tax brackets work.     I assume Fishin Guy is your real name? " my thoughts exactly... " The names Evan. There isn't a whole lot of difference in tax brackets when you look them up. So everyone is fine to just keep shelling out money to departments like this? You read on eBrandon all the time about where to find the cheapest this and that. I am not saying I want the cheapest but I would like to see how we can improve quality while keeping costs in line. Why can other provinces provide the same education at lower costs? Like I said student enrollment increased 8% over 5 years. Teacher costing has increased approx. 45% in the same 5 years. Division admin has increased 55%. Is everyone happy with the numbers? Let me ask the question.....At what point do the numbers become unsustainable? The BSD is a 90 million dollar budget. That is a lot of money for 1500 teachers and administration. 85% of that is wages. We will be pushing 100 million in less than a couple years. Next years taxes look for another increase. At what point to people start to question things? " Isn't that more than the city of Brandons?   Holy!     I know myself I have questioned but no one seems to care. The school board continues to raise taxes every single year.     The BSD had better not announce a surplus this year like previous years! Or the ca-ca will hit the fan! " I sent the school division at budget time voicing my frustration. There seems there is nothing that we as taxpayers can do. There is no accountability anywhere within the division. Short money...raise taxes. I explained it was even a waste of time to attend a budget meeting. We could all go in there with flaming pitchforks and nothing would change. The only thing that will change is the faces of the elected board. I laugh when they say "Good turnout at the budget meeting of teachers and students" Jesus the schools ask that teachers and students/parents attend. It is a tactic played so when you want to see budget justice they can point to little Suzie that has no idea why she should be there and tell you to think of this poor child's education and how you would be hurting her. You don't want to hurt her education do you? I don't have NDP Math blindness. 8% rise in students shouldn't equal 45% increase in wages. I don't care what math you have. Where is the justification in that? "

city budget meetings. I like the way the city does their budgets. First the department heads talk and make known their wishes for running their respective depts. Then at another meeting the public gets to voice their concerns with the spending.  
 
At not one of these meetings has a department head stood up and begged for more cash!  
 
I refuse to go to a school board meeting because it is just a ****-show with teachers, both retired and current getting up and asking for more money!

ultraguy said "Like I said student enrollment increased 8% over 5 years. Teacher costing has increased approx. 45% in the same 5 years. Division admin has increased 55%. Is everyone happy with the numbers?   Looking at these two budgets:   https://www.bsd.ca/board/budgetfinance/Documents/2017-2018%20-%20PSFB%20Frame%20Budget.pdf     https://www.bsd.ca/board/budgetfinance/Documents/Frame%20Budget%20June%2030%202014.pdf     Divisional Administration has gone from $2733k to $3372k. That is an increase of 23%     Regular Instruction has gone from $51,689k to $61,575k. That is an increase of 19%     Which areas increased by 45% and 55%? "

Are from 2011 to now. I didn't put all links in my posts as it would be rather lengthy and they are all on the divisions site. Back in 2011 we had a budget of just over 69 million. It has increased 30 million in 5 years. At a 2% rate of inflation increase puts yearly increases at under 1.5 million but our budgets increased 6 million a year. Regular instruction rose 36%, my calculations I broke down with departments such as Student Support Services, Community Ed. and Services, etc. I took the time to break down all department specific budgets and filled in each with the report out's own numbers from the divisions audited financial statements. From year to year the number isn't that large. Over many years that number is huge. That is what people don't see. We increased just under 650 students and gained over 90 teachers.

Meeting turnout. You mention that you get a good turnout from school staff and parents. I wonder why this is. Is it maybe that the schools request students, parents, and staff to attend? I already know this from division employees and an employee of mine was requested to attend as his daughter is on a basketball team. Hey what better way to put the public on the spot by filling it with teachers and “pro school” students and parents? I know this is a union tactic so it can try and ride on the guilt of “think of the students” mentality. As taxpayers what good is it to come to the meetings? Are all of you, if every taxpayer from the city attended and disapproved of increased spending within the division would it actually make a difference? Honestly I think it is ridiculous that 9 people are entrusted with a 100 million dollar budget for the best interests of the general student population. We need people to put the union in its place, not favor them. Reading eBrandon, the Sound Off in the Brandon Sun, local coffee shop chatter you get a large vote of pissed off people wanting you trustees to reel in spending costs that have run rampant over the years. There is no need for accountability. You say you need to raise the bar by x % and piss off the taxpayers, come election time a new vote of people come into play, the same cycle continues. Who cares right? No harm to anyone.  
 
All the information I have looked at is online from the BSD website. If my numbers seem to be off I am all about clarification of numbers. They all came from the audited financials and school report outs. There is a lot that bothers me. I went over the last 5 years. I have attached a word and excel document for comparing year to year. So from 2011-2016 student enrollments has increased an average of 8% or 641 students. Full time staff has increased 9% or 90 positions. The school division revenue has increased $31 million dollars or 45%. School division expenses have increased over $29 million or 44%. Seriously?!?! If I went to my boss and said that business has increased 8% but I need to increase my budget 44% to make it work I would be looking for another line of work. The same thing should be said about the school division.  
Regular instruction up 36%  
Student support services up 35%  
Instructional/Other support up 31%  
Division administration up 52%  
 
Reading the paper today. Kevan you made a comment that if we want costs down it would be taking more than 25 teachers out of classrooms. In the last 5 years we have hired 90 full time staff. That is an extra position for every 7 of the 641 extra student numbers. Brandon will receive an extra 2.3% increase in funding. That is perfect. That should be the cost of inflation right there. Done. Kevan if you want to look at cuts how about looking at the biggest white elephant in the room and that is wages. 85% of the budget is spent on wages. It frustrates me what employees get away with. Sub Services tracked last year a MONTHLY sub average of 3264 positions. 40% are same day call ins…..so roughly 1300 sick days per month? How much is that costing the division for replacements? Plus everyone knows that nothing gets done on sub days. So please, think of the students suffering with lack of teaching staff missing. With over 7000 applications for employment consideration there is NO SHORTAGE of qualified people looking for work. This kool aid of teachers needing master’s degrees to become better teachers is a farce and everyone knows it. It is to pad the wages and pension of the workers, plain and simple. I know this as my family already does this and laughs about it. It isn’t for the greater good of the students. Please. The ignorance of the school division just amazes me.  
 
The division talks about My Site. A student/teacher resource for day to day in the classroom and includes anywhere learning allowing staff and students 24/7 access to assignments, resource material, and documents created. This is exactly what my daughter had while schooling in Alberta. Even though my daughter blew her chance she was given the opportunity to complete core subjects if working at a daily pace, 3 weeks per core class for completion. The whole course was offered online with tutorials available. My friends have their children doing assignments at home and emailing teachers when done. This transition is basically putting a typical correspondence class online for regular students to complete at their own pace. With advancements in technology gone are the days of needing highly qualified staff. Pretty much anything we need to learn can be found online nowadays for regular instruction. I do still agree with having hands on to make learning fun such as Chemistry lab assignments of mixing chemicals, creating rocket cars, things like that. Most of the stuff that is regurgitated out of a text book, we don’t need master’s degrees for that.  
 
So please don’t tell me how wonderful the division is by being such and such place compared to other divisions in Manitoba. Last I checked Manitoba was one of the highest provinces for student spending. That is not sustainable and we need trustees that can reel in spending and not cater to every wish list item the division wants. It isn’t about helping out fellow teachers either. Again there is no way for an increase in 8% of students justifies spending increases of 44%. Low test scores compared to other provinces just doesn’t help justify the need for spending compared to other provinces too. Seems the division is more concerned with everyone’s feelings and well-being that our school basics are being forgotten. If our current curriculum doesn’t cut it why doesn’t the division do something about it? Again it is seen as a joke by staff what is taught in schools now. As a manager that hires our youth it is pathetic what is coming out of our school systems. Youth have weak basic math skills, low English skills, feelings….good God you think some would start crying if you become upset with their performance skills or lack of. Sorry I don’t give participation stickers to them daily for coming to work.  
 
Sorry for the long winded email. I am just a concerned taxpayer/parent/employer that realizes what the division is doing is not to the best of what it should be to me. Throwing money into something broken doesn’t always solve the problem. We all need to be tight with our wallets and not always get what we want. Common sense and practicality need to go hand in hand. Children should not be used as pawns. Remember there are more pockets raided to pay for those pockets padded. I really hope you trustees can realize this is not sustainable and to when is the tipping point. I really hope it is now and you all play an important part in keeping division budgets within the cost of inflation, which the province increases as such. With even 2% increase from the province that should cover budget requirements without tax increases.

Problem for us taxpayers in Manitoba is that at one point in time the government decided to hand over all accountability of the school division expenses to the school boards. The government essentially washed it''''s hands from financial accountability. When taxpayers complain to their MLA''s, the MLA just shrugs his shoulders and points the complainant to the school board.  
I apologize for not providing a link, but simply type in your search bar, "Reform to funding education four provinces". You"ll come up with interesting articles regarding Manitoban residential tax payers dilema regarding school taxes. I''ve cut an exerp from one document that indicates that Manitoba is the only province where the government has handed all financial responsibilities to the boards without the minister of education''''s oversight. Here it is:  
"The principal focus is on the reforms that have shifted the authority for setting  
property tax mill rates for education and responsibility for funding the  
education system between school boards and provincial governments. The  
article reveals that, whereas Alberta, Ontario, and Saskatchewan have  
followed the lead of six other provinces in centralizing such authority and  
responsibility in the provincial ministry of education, Manitoba has moved  
slightly in the opposite direction by reducing its role in setting property taxes  
for some classes of property and reducing its level of responsibility for  
funding the education system."  
Now I also read in a Winnipeg paper last month that the Pallister government recognizes this as a huge problem as tax payers are getting gouged by the boards. Hopefully this provincial government will take action and take a greater role in the school boards ability to set mil rates autonomisly.  
 
Edited by 70`s guy, 2017-04-03 22:12:59

We are still one of the lowest cost per student divisions in the province.  
My question is, "Do we win a prize when we hit the bottom?"

So if you suck at math, you'll blame you're teacher? Don't get me wrong, there are bad teachers - but no responsibility of your own? None?  
 
Ok, so now that we know how you think about your problems...  
 
There is also the question of 27.5 hours/week instructional time. That might be the time you SEE. You're forgetting extracurricular activities, and all work done outside the classroom. A LOT of work done outside the classroom. Again, I'm not entirely disagreeing with you - there are issues: but it seems to me the people who are hating on teachers are the ones who would likely be terrible at the job, and become the teachers they so admittedly talk down at.  
 
Also, when someone feels the need to say "I don't make up anything", I immediately become suspicious of them. Just saying.

loeog said "We are still one of the lowest cost per student divisions in the province.   My question is, "Do we win a prize when we hit the bottom?" "

We continually pat ourselves on the back while taxpayers continue to get gouged. You want a prize? Keep school taxes at or lower than the provinces cpi. After all, most taxpayers don''t see their incomes increasing at the same rate as school board increases. Can''t continue this way!  
https://www.pressreader.com/canada/winnipeg-sun/20170316/281569470539696  
 
Edited by 70`s guy, 2017-04-04 07:09:37

We won't be happy until we have the lowest costs in Canada.  
 
I suggest you stop bashing the system behind a fake name and get off your a$$ and run as a trustee, I might actually believe your are truly interested in being part of the solution instead of part of the problem.  
 
Nothing destroys a students desire to learn more than a parent or grandparent that does nothing but bash the education system.

loeog said "We won't be happy until we have the lowest costs in Canada.     I suggest you stop bashing the system behind a fake name and get off your a$$ and run as a trustee, I might actually believe your are truly interested in being part of the solution instead of part of the problem.     Nothing destroys a students desire to learn more than a parent or grandparent that does nothing but bash the education system. "

I Can't run for the board as I know nothing about running a district or even budgeting for it. Having said that though, I'm not sure all on the board know anything about running a district also. I do know that they understand about toying with mil rates to achieve their financial goals I do know that. Shame that I Can't adjust my mil rates so as not to go backwards in my finances. Time for the provincial government to give the education minister the task of overseeing how much school boards costs are kept in check with the rate of inflation.