Discussions

This is simply the end of Marijuana Prohibition. No different than liquor in 1924.  
 
Same competing interests. Same players. Same arguments.  
 
Grow your own? "Half of all wine consumed in Manitoba is homemade".  
 
So, what we learned in 93 years? Nothing, apparently.

Question for anyone who may know - what is the going rate per gram on the black market?

TheScotsman said "This is simply the end of Marijuana Prohibition. No different than liquor in 1924.     Same competing interests. Same players. Same arguments.     Grow your own? "Half of all wine consumed in Manitoba is homemade".     So, what we learned in 93 years? Nothing, apparently. "

I think with growing it how do you tax it? If you were a renter growing plants, if you had all utilities i:ncluded and the hydro jumps, how do you recoup your costs as a landlord. It isn't as cut and dry like wine, take a kit, mix some ingredients together, ferment, filter, bottle. More or less. Yes there are a few more steps but I found making booze was much easier than growing.

Home made wine is not taxed, that is the thing. Half of all wine consumed, in Manitoba, is not taxed. Throw in all the home made beer, illicit stills, smuggling, there is a lot of untaxed alcohol.  
 
So what do the old white guys in charge do? They dust off the Liquor Act from 1924.  
 
People that want to grow their own, already do. The majority will happily buy it in a store.

Fishin Guy said "    TheScotsman said "This is simply the end of Marijuana Prohibition. No different than liquor in 1924.     Same competing interests. Same players. Same arguments.     Grow your own? "Half of all wine consumed in Manitoba is homemade".     So, what we learned in 93 years? Nothing, apparently. " I think with growing it how do you tax it? If you were a renter growing plants, if you had all utilities i:ncluded and the hydro jumps, how do you recoup your costs as a landlord. It isn't as cut and dry like wine, take a kit, mix some ingredients together, ferment, filter, bottle. More or less. Yes there are a few more steps but I found making booze was much easier than growing. "

The way the system works right now is if you're a medical patient you can buy approved seeds or clones and you pay your tax when you order the seed/clones from a Canadian LP.  
 
There is no set-in-stone rule that says Cannabis needs to be grown with Hydroponics, you can grow it in buckets or pails just like many other house plants. Although you will still need lights and fans and ventilation etc.  
 
How it would work for the recreational market I am not sure since they've already decided to close that door. I would assume it would be the same model as the Hybrid Retail model though. If say Rick from Growers N Smokers got his License to Operate as a Dispensary next year for Recreational Cannabis, I would imagine you be able to buy seeds/clones through Rick that he purchases via Government Hybrid Model, which comes from the Canadian LPs. All of which you would pay tax on when you purchase it from Growers N Smokers or Whoever.

RC123 said "Question for anyone who may know - what is the going rate per gram on the black market? "

A quick google search and I was able to find 28 grams for $180 Canadian... just by doing a google search. Apparently its that easy to buy Grey Market Cannabis - Its actually very disturbing how many results came up online. DON'T BUY FROM GREY MARKET DISPENSARYS!!!  
 
To put this into perspective the Licensed Producer that I am signed up with charges me $270 for 30 grams of dried Cannabis and $90 for 40ML of CBD Oil which they say is equivalent to 5 grams of dried Cannabis.

Bassman said "    RC123 said "Question for anyone who may know - what is the going rate per gram on the black market? " A quick google search and I was able to find 28 grams for $180 Canadian... just by doing a google search. Apparently its that easy to buy Grey Market Cannabis - Its actually very disturbing how many results came up online. DON'T BUY FROM GREY MARKET DISPENSARYS!!!     To put this into perspective the Licensed Producer that I am signed up with charges me $270 for 30 grams of dried Cannabis and $90 for 40ML of CBD Oil which they say is equivalent to 5 grams of dried Cannabis. "

At those prices I would be buying off the street. My buddy with MS pays about $100 cheaper than your price. I am curious to your potency of CBD oil as per its pricing. At 5 grams of Cannabis you can pay half that price for leaf vs oil.

Bassman said "    Fishin Guy said "    TheScotsman said "This is simply the end of Marijuana Prohibition. No different than liquor in 1924.     Same competing interests. Same players. Same arguments.     Grow your own? "Half of all wine consumed in Manitoba is homemade".     So, what we learned in 93 years? Nothing, apparently. " I think with growing it how do you tax it? If you were a renter growing plants, if you had all utilities i:ncluded and the hydro jumps, how do you recoup your costs as a landlord. It isn't as cut and dry like wine, take a kit, mix some ingredients together, ferment, filter, bottle. More or less. Yes there are a few more steps but I found making booze was much easier than growing. " The way the system works right now is if you're a medical patient you can buy approved seeds or clones and you pay your tax when you order the seed/clones from a Canadian LP.     There is no set-in-stone rule that says Cannabis needs to be grown with Hydroponics, you can grow it in buckets or pails just like many other house plants. Although you will still need lights and fans and ventilation etc.     How it would work for the recreational market I am not sure since they've already decided to close that door. I would assume it would be the same model as the Hybrid Retail model though. If say Rick from Growers N Smokers got his License to Operate as a Dispensary next year for Recreational Cannabis, I would imagine you be able to buy seeds/clones through Rick that he purchases via Government Hybrid Model, which comes from the Canadian LPs. All of which you would pay tax on when you purchase it from Growers N Smokers or Whoever. "

At least what we are getting is a start. Looking at the liquor laws they seem to loosen as years go by. This is an introductory year. They are covering basics right now. It wasn't too long ago that we could now bring our own wine to a restaurant and pay a corkage fee. Take home open bottles, created stores that allow you to brew at a store, bottle, etc. So with liquor it is ever changing. Marijuana laws will too. It will be a matter of time and they will eventually allow it. No matter what complaints will always be made.

28grams is one ounce. There for I don’t know how you would find an ounce for less than $180.00 because generally it’s 10$ a gram street value. That much hasn’t changed. I know because even when you order medical cannabis it takes time to ship. The grey market is probably going to survive over the black market as people do concern themselves with quality.

Now now, I'm sure people are going to jump all over my post with hate, but hear me out for just a second.  
 
Growing marijuana in homes is terrible for a house. If I was a home-owner looking to rent out my place and people started growing weed in there, it destroys the value of my home. Many banks refuse to purchase mortgages on homes where marijuana has been grown. And not just because it's illegal, but because homes that have been grow ups can often have:  
 
- Modified ductwork that doesn’t seem to make sense.  
 
-Circular holes in floor joists or roof trusses from venting  
 
- damaged chunks of brickwork which need to be replaced  
 
- Brown stains in soffits (the exposed undersurface of a roof eave) from the grow-op venting to the outside.  
 
- Roof warping from extremely uneven heating spots  
 
- Stains on basement floors from pots that sat there for long periods of time, or stains in laundry tubs.  
 
- Modified wiring and electrical panel. Sometimes live wires can still be in the insulation.  
 
- Added plumbing for water supply and drains that isn't at all up to code  
 
- Foundations and concrete walls cored or breached to get wiring around the hydro meter.  
 
- Warped/rotted wooden structures (staircases, floors and window cases) due to moisture damage.  
 
-Toxic moulds form/spread poisonous spores in the open, within wall cavities, inside window frames, ventilation systems and attic spaces. This can get into the joists and be impossible to get rid of.  
 
- A musty smell that is really hard to get rid of.  
 
 
To be clear, I am 100% in favor of legalization. However, I am completely fine with telling people they cannot grow their own. Now that said, if there was a law that said "You can grow your own marijuana in an outdoor greenhouse structure" I'd be fine with that.  
 
However if it suddenly became legal to grow weed in your home and I was a landlord, I would IMMEDIATELY be getting out of it. As it is now, it's hard enough while it's illegal. Personally, I believe landlords should be able to sue tenants who grow marijuana in their homes because of the damage that it does.  
 
So yeah, all for legalized pot. Not at all for home damage.

underXtheXradar said "Now now, I'm sure people are going to jump all over my post with hate, but hear me out for just a second.     Growing marijuana in homes is terrible for a house. If I was a home-owner looking to rent out my place and people started growing weed in there, it destroys the value of my home. Many banks refuse to purchase mortgages on homes where marijuana has been grown. And not just because it's illegal, but because homes that have been grow ups can often have:     - Modified ductwork that doesn’t seem to make sense.     -Circular holes in floor joists or roof trusses from venting     - damaged chunks of brickwork which need to be replaced     - Brown stains in soffits (the exposed undersurface of a roof eave) from the grow-op venting to the outside.     - Roof warping from extremely uneven heating spots     - Stains on basement floors from pots that sat there for long periods of time, or stains in laundry tubs.     - Modified wiring and electrical panel. Sometimes live wires can still be in the insulation.     - Added plumbing for water supply and drains that isn't at all up to code     - Foundations and concrete walls cored or breached to get wiring around the hydro meter.     - Warped/rotted wooden structures (staircases, floors and window cases) due to moisture damage.     -Toxic moulds form/spread poisonous spores in the open, within wall cavities, inside window frames, ventilation systems and attic spaces. This can get into the joists and be impossible to get rid of.     - A musty smell that is really hard to get rid of.       To be clear, I am 100% in favor of legalization. However, I am completely fine with telling people they cannot grow their own. Now that said, if there was a law that said "You can grow your own marijuana in an outdoor greenhouse structure" I'd be fine with that.     However if it suddenly became legal to grow weed in your home and I was a landlord, I would IMMEDIATELY be getting out of it. As it is now, it's hard enough while it's illegal. Personally, I believe landlords should be able to sue tenants who grow marijuana in their homes because of the damage that it does.     So yeah, all for legalized pot. Not at all for home damage. "

All I could find but  
 
"grow op·er·a·tion  
noun CANADIAN  
noun: grow operation: plural noun: grow operations  
an enterprise or facility engaged in growing and selling marijuana.  
"the sheriff's marijuana eradication team came upon a grow operation near Mount Isabel""  
 
grow-op  
noun CANADIAN informal  
an enterprise or facility engaged in growing and selling marijuana.  
"police seized more than $2 million in marijuana after an outdoor grow-op was discovered"  
 
We are talking about 4 plants here not an operation worth 2 million dollars.  
 
What about those who already own there own home? Why should your choice to rent out your basement have any effect on what I choose to do in mine? See the problem?  
 
If you rent an apartment the landlord should have say in whats allowed and whats not, no different than the system is already setup. Have a dog? You gotta find a landlord that allows dogs, wanna grow 4 plants? Well you should have to find a landlord who will allow you to grow 4 plants.  
 
I see where you are coming from but I have to disagree.

Fishin Guy said "    Bassman said "    RC123 said "Question for anyone who may know - what is the going rate per gram on the black market? " A quick google search and I was able to find 28 grams for $180 Canadian... just by doing a google search. Apparently its that easy to buy Grey Market Cannabis - Its actually very disturbing how many results came up online. DON'T BUY FROM GREY MARKET DISPENSARYS!!!     To put this into perspective the Licensed Producer that I am signed up with charges me $270 for 30 grams of dried Cannabis and $90 for 40ML of CBD Oil which they say is equivalent to 5 grams of dried Cannabis. " At those prices I would be buying off the street. My buddy with MS pays about $100 cheaper than your price. I am curious to your potency of CBD oil as per its pricing. At 5 grams of Cannabis you can pay half that price for leaf vs oil. "

25 mg/ml is what my pres:cription bottle says.

underXtheXradar said "Now now, I'm sure people are going to jump all over my post with hate, but hear me out for just a second.     Growing marijuana in homes is terrible for a house. If I was a home-owner looking to rent out my place and people started growing weed in there, it destroys the value of my home. Many banks refuse to purchase mortgages on homes where marijuana has been grown. And not just because it's illegal, but because homes that have been grow ups can often have:     - Modified ductwork that doesn’t seem to make sense.     -Circular holes in floor joists or roof trusses from venting     - damaged chunks of brickwork which need to be replaced     - Brown stains in soffits (the exposed undersurface of a roof eave) from the grow-op venting to the outside.     - Roof warping from extremely uneven heating spots     - Stains on basement floors from pots that sat there for long periods of time, or stains in laundry tubs.     - Modified wiring and electrical panel. Sometimes live wires can still be in the insulation.     - Added plumbing for water supply and drains that isn't at all up to code     - Foundations and concrete walls cored or breached to get wiring around the hydro meter.     - Warped/rotted wooden structures (staircases, floors and window cases) due to moisture damage.     -Toxic moulds form/spread poisonous spores in the open, within wall cavities, inside window frames, ventilation systems and attic spaces. This can get into the joists and be impossible to get rid of.     - A musty smell that is really hard to get rid of.       To be clear, I am 100% in favor of legalization. However, I am completely fine with telling people they cannot grow their own. Now that said, if there was a law that said "You can grow your own marijuana in an outdoor greenhouse structure" I'd be fine with that.     However if it suddenly became legal to grow weed in your home and I was a landlord, I would IMMEDIATELY be getting out of it. As it is now, it's hard enough while it's illegal. Personally, I believe landlords should be able to sue tenants who grow marijuana in their homes because of the damage that it does.     So yeah, all for legalized pot. Not at all for home damage. "

That’s a large amount of work for 4 plants.  
 
Edited by loeog, 2017-12-11 20:49:43

A family member who has his license is paying $90 for 5 gram worth of oil, weed is $45 for 5 grams. So that seems like a reasonable price then considering street value is $10 a gram for who knows what quality. He said it comes in the mail within 4 days from date it’s ordered and that is with the free shipping option

RainaRo said "28grams is one ounce. There for I don’t know how you would find an ounce for less than $180.00 because generally it’s 10$ a gram street value. That much hasn’t changed. I know because even when you order medical cannabis it takes time to ship. The grey market is probably going to survive over the black market as people do concern themselves with quality. "

I don't know anyone who would pay straight up street pricing. The larger the amount the cheaper it gets. Friends buying medical are only paying around the $235 mark for 1.5 oz. $5-$6 per gram. That is where it needs to be buying full amounts like that. At $10 straight up you better have one killer strain.

The federal rule of 4 plants was reasonable. Nobody is going to modify a house for 4 plants.A grow operation is something very different. I can't see grow-ops actually being a thing after legalization, there's no longer a profit motive big enough to make the investment.  
 
Seriously, given a choice, most people are going to grab some pot when they're getting their chips and drinks at Shoppers Drug Mart (assuming they get contract) rather than seek out their "guy". People are lazy and will go with the easiest option.  
 
You can make your own soda, most of us buy bottled.  
You can make your own beer and wine, yet the Liquor Mart is crazy ass busy the day before a holiday.  
You can grow your own tobacco, don't think it's an issue.  
 
After legalization, most marijuana consumed in Canada will be sold at retail. The Tory's rules are weird.  
 
I have to agree with Cory. Just a few months ago I saw the mayor of either Winkler or Morden losing his mind that his government might have to pass laws about pot like already exist for alcohol or tobacco. He obviously still wanted it illegal and it was totally a religious issue in the town. A lot of the Tory support comes fro that Pembina Triangle area of Manitoba, so they need to be seen to at least be resisting the "devil weed" enough to be on the same team. It's political, and I suspect a judge will change it soon enough.